Chamber
Plenary, 29 Oct 2009
29 Oct 2009 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
Marine Scotland Bill: Stage 1
The bill mentions seal management plans, of course. We believe that they are a huge step forward in addressing issues relating to Scotland's seal populations.
Many members have mentioned the debate about whether duties should be included in the bill, as against ministers simply taking powers in a number of areas. As I mentioned in my opening remarks, we have an open mind about where we should stipulate duties in the bill and where amendments might be possible in that regard. We will discuss that with the committee in the weeks ahead. I echo the comments of my UK counterpart at Westminster, made in the past couple of days, I think. The point was made that the more duties that are placed on ministers through legislation, the more effectively a lawyers charter will be created. I do not think that any member wants to go down that road. There may be a case for introducing duties for ministers in some areas, but we want to avoid that in other areas if possible.
I remind members that by establishing marine protected areas we will acknowledge the value of those areas of the marine environment that we think are precious and need to be protected. If we wished to go a step further and to introduce restrictions, we would have to introduce a marine conservation order. Of course, the Parliament will have full opportunity to scrutinise such orders to ensure that factors that members have mentioned are taken into account. There will be a full process in the Parliament for such orders. I hope that that addresses concerns that members have expressed.
Marine Scotland, which will be the champion of Scotland's seas, will play a leading role on some of those issues. Members have mentioned that. We set up Marine Scotland to avoid a further year's delay while we waited for the bill to go through Parliament. Most people acknowledge—the stakeholders groups do—that getting it up and running as soon as possible was a good idea.
Members have expressed concerns about the independence of the science that Marine Scotland will use. Only last week, Marine Scotland advertised for members of the science advisory board that is being established to ensure that independent scientific advice will be mainstreamed into the workings of Marine Scotland. I hope that that reassures members.
I remind members that the marine strategy framework directive, which, as I mentioned earlier, will be transposed into Scottish law, will put an obligation on the Scottish Government and all UK Administrations to establish an ecologically coherent network of marine protected areas. The Convention for the Protection of the Marine Environment of the North-East Atlantic—the OSPAR convention—which Scotland has already signed up to through the UK Government, also places such an obligation on the Scottish and UK Governments.
I hope that I have addressed the key issues that members have raised. Again, I thank the committee for all its hard work, and I thank all our stakeholders and the general public, who have taken an intense interest in the bill. The bill has attracted comments from many members of the public in the past year or so.
I have listened carefully to the points that members have made and we will take forward many of those ideas. We will reflect on the comments that have been made by members of the Rural Affairs and Environment Committee and by other members in the chamber. As I have said, the Scottish Government intends to lodge amendments at stage 2, and that dialogue will continue in the weeks ahead.
Our seas are very special, as the chamber has acknowledged. Our seas will feed the nation in the decades ahead and they will power our nation, helping us to tackle climate change. We need our seas and our seas need us to protect them—that is what the bill is all about. I thank members for supporting it at stage 1.
Many members have mentioned the debate about whether duties should be included in the bill, as against ministers simply taking powers in a number of areas. As I mentioned in my opening remarks, we have an open mind about where we should stipulate duties in the bill and where amendments might be possible in that regard. We will discuss that with the committee in the weeks ahead. I echo the comments of my UK counterpart at Westminster, made in the past couple of days, I think. The point was made that the more duties that are placed on ministers through legislation, the more effectively a lawyers charter will be created. I do not think that any member wants to go down that road. There may be a case for introducing duties for ministers in some areas, but we want to avoid that in other areas if possible.
I remind members that by establishing marine protected areas we will acknowledge the value of those areas of the marine environment that we think are precious and need to be protected. If we wished to go a step further and to introduce restrictions, we would have to introduce a marine conservation order. Of course, the Parliament will have full opportunity to scrutinise such orders to ensure that factors that members have mentioned are taken into account. There will be a full process in the Parliament for such orders. I hope that that addresses concerns that members have expressed.
Marine Scotland, which will be the champion of Scotland's seas, will play a leading role on some of those issues. Members have mentioned that. We set up Marine Scotland to avoid a further year's delay while we waited for the bill to go through Parliament. Most people acknowledge—the stakeholders groups do—that getting it up and running as soon as possible was a good idea.
Members have expressed concerns about the independence of the science that Marine Scotland will use. Only last week, Marine Scotland advertised for members of the science advisory board that is being established to ensure that independent scientific advice will be mainstreamed into the workings of Marine Scotland. I hope that that reassures members.
I remind members that the marine strategy framework directive, which, as I mentioned earlier, will be transposed into Scottish law, will put an obligation on the Scottish Government and all UK Administrations to establish an ecologically coherent network of marine protected areas. The Convention for the Protection of the Marine Environment of the North-East Atlantic—the OSPAR convention—which Scotland has already signed up to through the UK Government, also places such an obligation on the Scottish and UK Governments.
I hope that I have addressed the key issues that members have raised. Again, I thank the committee for all its hard work, and I thank all our stakeholders and the general public, who have taken an intense interest in the bill. The bill has attracted comments from many members of the public in the past year or so.
I have listened carefully to the points that members have made and we will take forward many of those ideas. We will reflect on the comments that have been made by members of the Rural Affairs and Environment Committee and by other members in the chamber. As I have said, the Scottish Government intends to lodge amendments at stage 2, and that dialogue will continue in the weeks ahead.
Our seas are very special, as the chamber has acknowledged. Our seas will feed the nation in the decades ahead and they will power our nation, helping us to tackle climate change. We need our seas and our seas need us to protect them—that is what the bill is all about. I thank members for supporting it at stage 1.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Trish Godman):
Lab
The next item of business is a debate on motion S3M-4969, in the name of Richard Lochhead, on stage 1 of the Marine (Scotland) Bill. I call Richard Lochhead ...
The Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs and the Environment (Richard Lochhead):
SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer. I was not sure whether it was the convener of the Rural Affairs and Environment Committee who was going to open the debate, but...
Maureen Watt (North East Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I am pleased to speak in the debate on behalf of the Rural Affairs and Environment Committee. This is a big bill on an important subject: the custodianship o...
Elaine Murray (Dumfries) (Lab):
Lab
Scottish Labour supports the principles of the Marine (Scotland) Bill and welcomes many of its provisions. However, in our view, the bill could be improved a...
John Scott (Ayr) (Con):
Con
I begin by thanking our clerks and SPICe for their help. I also thank those who gave evidence in oral and written form and those who hosted the Rural Affairs...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con):
Con
Hear, hear.
John Scott:
Con
Thank you.Local, broadly based and appropriately sized marine planning partnerships must develop integrated plans to achieve the responsible management and i...
Liam McArthur (Orkney) (LD):
LD
I am delighted to open the debate on the Marine (Scotland) Bill on behalf of my party. Scottish Liberal Democrats have been long-standing supporters of such ...
Bill Wilson (West of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
As with that long return to Ithaca, with its many trials and tribulations, so, no doubt, will be our journey to a healthier marine environment. We lack good ...
Peter Peacock (Highlands and Islands) (Lab):
Lab
Like other members, I very much welcome the bill and support its general principles. As the cabinet secretary and Liam McArthur said, the bill has had a long...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Alasdair Morgan):
SNP
I am sure that I never glower, Mr Peacock.
John Farquhar Munro (Ross, Skye and Inverness West) (LD):
LD
I welcome the opportunity to speak about the Marine (Scotland) Bill. The bill has been a long time in coming and the Liberal Democrats have repeatedly called...
Robin Harper (Lothians) (Green):
Green
John Farquhar Munro expressed concern about paying too much attention to scientists and marine science because it might slow things up. However, the problems...
Alasdair Allan (Western Isles) (SNP):
SNP
The member rightly says that we should listen to scientists. Does he concede that we should also listen to communities and that one reason why the European C...
Robin Harper:
Green
The Liberal Democrats have already voiced their concerns in that area. All that I have to say on that issue at present is that it is clearly up for further d...
Stuart McMillan (West of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I am delighted to take part in the debate, not as a member of the Rural Affairs and Environment Committee or as a scientist, but as someone with an interest ...
Jim Hume (South of Scotland) (LD):
LD
I welcome the chance to sum up this debate on the important subject of the Marine (Scotland) Bill. As Liam McArthur and John Farquhar Munro have stated, the ...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con):
Con
I refer members to my fishery interests in the members' register of interests.As my friend John Scott indicated in his opening speech, we strongly welcome th...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
The member should wind up.
Jamie McGrigor:
Con
On the subject of aquaculture, one other concern that industry representatives have put to me is that the bill proposes to introduce a universal licensing sy...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
The member must sit down.
Jamie McGrigor:
Con
—and inconsistency. Thank you, Presiding Officer.
Karen Gillon (Clydesdale) (Lab):
Lab
The debate has been interesting and, in the main, remarkably consensual. The areas of concern as well as the areas of consent are broadly accepted by the Rur...
Richard Lochhead:
SNP
There has been a lot of unanimity in the debate, which I welcome. Only the Liberal Democrats reverted to type from time to time. They said that everything wa...
Jamie McGrigor:
Con
During the first parliamentary session, I think that Ross Finnie, who was a minister, mentioned the possibility of a seal commission. Has the minister given ...
Richard Lochhead:
SNP
The bill mentions seal management plans, of course. We believe that they are a huge step forward in addressing issues relating to Scotland's seal populations...