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Showing 60 of 2,096,445 contributions. Latest 30 days: 3,975. Coverage: 12 May 1999 — 11 Jun 2026.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
17:18
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
That concludes decision time.17:31The rest of this Official Report will be published progressively as soon as the text is available.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The final question is, that motion S7M-00346, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, on behalf of the Parliamentary Bureau, on committee membership, be agreed to.Motion agreed to,That the Parliament agrees the membership of committees of the Parliament as follows—Climate Action Committ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, as amended, is: For 67, Against 25, Abstentions 26.Motion, as amended, agreed to,That the Parliament welcomes that the...
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAdam, George (Paisley) (SNP)Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)Ahmed, Irshad (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Lab)Anderson, Heather (Dundee City West) (SNP)Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire West and Levern Valley) (SNP)Baillie, ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
Your vote has been recorded.
David Green (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (LD) LD Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I am sorry—I could not connect to the voting app. I would have abstained.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.The vote is closed.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The sixth question is, that motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, as amended, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.1, in the name of David Green, is: For 36, Against 67, Abstentions 16.Amendment disagreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForBannerman, Max (Highlands and Islands) (Reform)Baxter, Andrew (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (LD)Beresford, Senga (South Scotland) (Reform)Bland, Amanda (Central Scot and Lothians West) (Reform)Briggs, Miles (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Con)Carson, Finlay (Galloway and Wes...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
Your vote will be recorded.
Duncan Dunlop (South Scotland) (LD) LD Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I apologise—my vote was not recorded. I would have voted yes.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.The vote is closed.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The fifth question is, that amendment S7M-00309.1, in the name of David Green, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.5, in the name of Murdo Fraser, is: For 26, Against 91, Abstentions 0.Amendment disagreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForBannerman, Max (Highlands and Islands) (Reform)Beresford, Senga (South Scotland) (Reform)Bland, Amanda (Central Scot and Lothians West) (Reform)Briggs, Miles (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Con)Carson, Finlay (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con)Currie, Victor (Highlands and Is...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The next question is, that amendment S7M-00309.5, in the name of Murdo Fraser, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.2, in the name of Lorna Slater, is: For 66, Against 27, Abstentions 26.Amendment agreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAdam, George (Paisley) (SNP)Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)Anderson, Heather (Dundee City West) (SNP)Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire West and Levern Valley) (SNP)Barratt, David (Cowdenbeath) (SNP)Beattie, Colin (Midlothi...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The next question is, that amendment S7M-00309.2, in the name of Lorna Slater, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.4, in the name of Malcolm Offord, is: For 17, Against 92, Abstentions 9.Amendment disagreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForBannerman, Max (Highlands and Islands) (Reform)Beresford, Senga (South Scotland) (Reform)Bland, Amanda (Central Scot and Lothians West) (Reform)Currie, Victor (Highlands and Islands) (Reform)Kerr, Thomas (Glasgow) (Reform)Kirkwood, David (South Scotland) (Reform)Langan, Jam...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
I remind members that, if the amendment in the name of Malcolm Offord is agreed to, the amendment in the name of Murdo Fraser will fall.The next question is, that amendment S7M-00309.4, in the name of Malcolm Offord, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan M...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.3, in the name of Michael Marra, is: For 94, Against 15, Abstentions 9.Amendment agreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAdam, George (Paisley) (SNP)Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)Ahmed, Irshad (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Lab)Anderson, Heather (Dundee City West) (SNP)Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire West and Levern Valley) (SNP)Baillie, ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
Okay, thank you.
Lorna Slater (Edinburgh Central) (Green) Green Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
My apologies, Presiding Officer. That was left over from when the app was not working.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
We come to the vote on amendment S7M-00309.3, in the name of Michael Marra, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee. Members should cast their vote now.The vote is closed.We have a point of order from Lorna Slater.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division. There will be a short suspension to allow members to access the digital voting system.17:18Meeting suspended.17:21On resuming—
The Presiding Officer (Kenneth Gibson) NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There are seven questions to be put as a result of today’s business. The first question is, that amendment S7M-00309.3, in the name of Michael Marra, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
The question on the motion will be put at decision time.
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
I hate to disappoint Ivan McKee, but his speech was not the last speech before the world cup. I will also undoubtedly disappoint other members given that we are looking to get out, but I will not take too long.Members will be aware that standing orders require the Parliamentar...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
Go on—why not?
The Minister for Parliamentary Business and Veterans (Jamie Hepburn) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
I will move and speak to the motion, Presiding Officer.
The Presiding Officer (Kenneth Gibson) NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
The next item of business is consideration of Parliamentary Bureau motion S7M-00346, on committee membership. I ask Jamie Hepburn, on behalf of the Parliamentary Bureau, to move the motion.17:16
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
That concludes the debate on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities.
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Does Mr Kerr want to intervene? I will get the time back, so I am happy to take his point. No, he does not. Okay.We have already saved more than £50 million on estates. I thought that it was 12, but we have now, in fact, shut 13 Scottish Government buildings. Murdo Fraser has ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Mr Kerr, you know to try to intervene rather than to attack from a sedentary position.
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I think that the confusion is more broad. The Reform manifesto talks about getting rid of all 130 public bodies—or “quangos”, as they call them. However, there is also a recognition from across the Reform benches that those public bodies—whether Police Scotland, the court syst...
Victor Currie (Highlands and Islands) (Reform) Reform Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Does the cabinet secretary recall that Max Bannerman’s point on community wind farms was that they do not rely on subsidies? Therefore, it forms no contradiction in Reform policy on our opposition to net zero.
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Yes. David Barratt also draws out the important point that the inconsistency in the Reform position is quite apparent. Reform members say in their amendment that we should not be talking about this stuff, and then they go on to talk about it from very different and contradicto...
David Barratt SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
—renewable energy schemes and for community-owned wind. Does the cabinet secretary agree that that is not the kind of reform that we need?
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Hello. It is not a speech within a speech. It is an intervention.
David Barratt SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
In moving the Reform amendment, Malcolm Offord stated that the Scottish Government should have no remit on net zero and energy, and he suggested cutting public bodies that are responsible for related areas. In contrast, Max Bannerman noted the value of community wind power in ...
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I will take David Barratt’s intervention, and then I will go on to talk about those other contributions.
David Barratt (Cowdenbeath) (SNP) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
In principle, we need stability of funding and to recognise the great work that happens in community organisations, which I see every week in my constituency. That work is absolutely critical, because those organisations are, to a large extent, the front line, and their abilit...
Bob Doris SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I commend the comments on the third sector that we have heard in the chamber this afternoon. I draw the cabinet secretary’s attention to the Social Justice and Social Security Committee’s report on funding of the third and voluntary sectors, and I highlight the longer-term fun...
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
On reflection, I am happy with the extent of the contributions that we have heard this afternoon. As I indicated at the outset, I was keen to hear from members, and that is what has happened for the most part. I will try to pick my way through the mind map that I have in front...
The Presiding Officer (Kenneth Gibson) NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Before I call the cabinet secretary, I say to members that, if they seek to make an intervention, they should remember to stand up and ask to make an intervention. I notice that buttons are pressed but, sometimes, the speakers do not see who is trying to intervene.17:05
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Clare Adamson) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
We move to the open debate.15:58
Alyn Smith (Stirling) (SNP) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I congratulate Ivan McKee—I will call him super Ivan, given the scale of his task, based on his speech and the vision that he has set out today.From listening to colleagues from across the chamber, I am struck that there is a lot of common ground here, and I think that we need...
David Green (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (LD) LD Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I begin by welcoming the cabinet secretary to his new role and wishing him well. As we have already heard, Mr McKee has been handed what might become the defining task of this Government, which is tackling the £5 billion black hole in Scotland’s finances. As Murdo Fraser has j...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Clare Adamson) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I call Murdo Fraser, who joins us online.15:47
Michael Marra Lab Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I point gently to the fact that Alyn Smith’s party had an outright majority in the Parliament for one of those parliamentary sessions, so not having had the numbers is not a foolproof excuse.Alyn Smith will find common ground across different areas. My note of caution to him w...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I should explain that I am having to contribute remotely today due to a family issue; otherwise, I would be in the chamber.I welcome Ivan McKee to his new role as Cabinet Secretary for Public Service Reform. I know that he is keen to dispel the notion that he is here as an axe...
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Chamber

Plenary, 06 Sep 2007

06 Sep 2007 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
Drugs Misuse
McNeil, Duncan Lab Greenock and Inverclyde Watch on SPTV
I welcome the opportunity to discuss this issue. Because of its impact on communities and families right across Scotland, no issue is more important for us to discuss. Who could argue with the view that we should reach a political consensus on how to deal with the issue? However, our views on how to deal with it sometimes differ.

The current methadone programme is a key part of the harm-reduction approach to drug abuse. It was supposed to stop addicts dying, but drug-related deaths have continued to rise—up by 25 per cent last year. It was supposed to get addicts off drugs by providing a legal substitute, but 70 per cent of those on methadone are still getting their illegal hits anyway. It was supposed to cut drug-related crime, but 80 per cent of addicts on methadone are still committing crimes, and our prisons are full of inmates with drug addictions.

We have to grasp this issue. Members may not all agree, but I feel that by making drug use affordable and acceptable, current policies are conspiring to keep addicts in what—over generations in some cases—has become a way of life. The sad fact behind recent reported deaths is that some of those people were not our children but our grandparents. The harm-reduction approach has increased the risk for our children and our communities. Therefore, calls for "more support" or "more of the same" will not help. We have heard such calls from members this morning.

Is the answer not to challenge the lack of ambition that saw stabilisation as the only realistic policy goal? We have to move towards cessation schemes. We have to challenge drug-taking behaviour and have a clear ambition—as Stuart McMillan said earlier—to get as many people as we can back to their families, back to work and back into the community.

We have to acknowledge that some people who take drugs have multiple problems. However, whether we accept it or not, there are also people who like drugs and choose to take them. That behaviour has to be challenged. Those people are not the only innocent victims; the child, the neighbour and the parent of the addict are the victims as well.

If the Executive is intent on setting up another consultation, that is a worthy intention. If we can reach a consensus on how to challenge the present situation, that will be great. However, I give members a reminder—as if it were needed—about how the children of drug-abusing parents find their way on to the priority lists. The reminder is from the recently published letters of assurance that the Executive sought from local authorities. Those letters reveal that any number of children in Scotland may be living—unidentified and unprotected—in the squalor of parental drug addiction.

Among the correspondence is a submission in which Strathclyde Police chief constable Sir Willie Rae and NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde chief executive Tom Divers concede that

"At this present time, we could not provide general assurance that all children affected by substance misuse have been identified."

Those men are very senior figures delivering services in our communities.

However, that is just the tip of the iceberg. The Executive's own summary acknowledges that

"the vast majority of … areas experience difficulty in consistently identifying those children affected by drug misuse."

That was reported by child protection committees.

In Inverclyde, the past council leader Alan Blair acknowledged that children were living in such circumstances. He admitted that their safety could not be guaranteed. In North Lanarkshire, a report signed off by council, health and police chiefs states:

"We cannot provide a definitive guarantee that all children who … have parents who are misusing substances have been identified."

Senior figures in South Lanarkshire assert that the reason why

"it is never possible to be entirely confident in relation to the identification of all children … affected by parental drug use"

is that drug users are hidden from services. However, precisely where those self-sufficient drug addicts—who have never accessed housing benefit, child benefit, council tax benefit, a general practitioner, a social worker, the housing department or any other public service—are to be found is, alas, not divulged.

I could go on, but time is limited and I am sure that members get the picture. Children are being failed by a system that does not even see them as a statistic. Local authorities have been given a clear duty by the Executive to ensure that addicts' children get the services they need before they are at risk of harm. However, as has now been revealed by the letters of assurance, local authorities are nothing like able to meet that obligation.

The inability to identify, far less protect, a significant number of children and young people is not only creating much needless suffering but risking another child's preventable death. I therefore renew my call to the minister—whether it be Shona Robison, Fergus Ewing, Kenny MacAskill, Adam Ingram, or whoever can be put in post specifically to deal with this issue—to act now. There are no excuses and there can be no delay. Those children need our help now.

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson): NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S3M-415, in the name of Kenny MacAskill, on tackling drugs misuse. I call Fergus Ewing to speak to and move t...
The Minister for Community Safety (Fergus Ewing): SNP
It is fitting that the first Government debate of the new parliamentary year concerns an issue that is vital to the future of Scotland. If we are to realise ...
Margaret Smith (Edinburgh West) (LD): LD
I thank colleagues for their courtesy in allowing me to head off early because of my back problems.I echo Fergus Ewing's comments on the importance of the is...
The Presiding Officer: NPA
I thank Miss Smith for her courtesy in informing me that she is unable to stay for the entire debate.
Margaret Curran (Glasgow Baillieston) (Lab): Lab
You will note, Presiding Officer, that we have not submitted a Labour amendment to the motion. That should not imply that we have no questions or issues to r...
Brian Adam (Aberdeen North) (SNP): SNP
I hope that the member does not wish to create the impression that illicit drugs use occurs exclusively in our deprived communities, because that is not the ...
Margaret Curran: Lab
I suspect that Brian Adam is the only person to draw that conclusion, as I did not say that drugs misuse is exclusive to deprived areas. However, statistical...
Annabel Goldie (West of Scotland) (Con): Con
I very much welcome this opportunity to debate the issue of tackling drugs misuse and congratulate the cabinet secretary on bringing the topic to the chamber...
Dr Richard Simpson (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab): Lab
The mandatory testing system that the Conservatives introduced at great expense into the prison service a considerable time ago has been counterproductive. I...
Annabel Goldie: Con
I am not able to agree totally with Dr Simpson, although his attitude probably explains why we now have such an unprecedented drug addiction problem in our p...
Christine Grahame (South of Scotland) (SNP): SNP
I will endeavour not to repeat statistics that have already been cited in the debate, but perhaps I can begin by highlighting a few other figures. Although I...
Dr Simpson: Lab
I am sorry to contradict Christine Grahame, but the Scottish schools adolescent lifestyle and substance use survey, which is a two-yearly study that looks at...
Christine Grahame: SNP
I defer to Dr Simpson's knowledge in certain areas, but the headline that I quoted refers to a serious report, which I hope he will read. Its evidence reflec...
Trish Godman (West Renfrewshire) (Lab): Lab
The motion says everything—well, almost everything. There is not a lot in it with which we could disagree. However, there is not enough—or perhaps anything—a...
Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD): LD
I will use speeches that we have heard so far as the framework for mine. Fergus Ewing gave a full account of the work that he is undertaking—we wish him the ...
Stuart McMillan (West of Scotland) (SNP): SNP
Members will have various experiences of the drugs problems in Scotland and in their local communities. I certainly hope that the new SNP Government can buil...
Dr Simpson: Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
Stuart McMillan: SNP
I am sorry, but not at the moment.I live in Greenock in Inverclyde, an area that has well-documented drugs problems. Duncan McNeil and I are fully aware of t...
Duncan McNeil (Greenock and Inverclyde) (Lab): Lab
I welcome the opportunity to discuss this issue. Because of its impact on communities and families right across Scotland, no issue is more important for us t...
John Lamont (Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con): Con
A couple of weeks ago, I served a night shift with the local police force down in my constituency in the Borders. I was able to see at first hand what the po...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Alasdair Morgan): SNP
I can give Bill Wilson just under six minutes.
Bill Wilson (West of Scotland) (SNP): SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer—that means that I can put some of the scored-out bits of my speech back in.I congratulate Fergus Ewing on his presentation of th...
Mike Pringle (Edinburgh South) (LD): LD
I am delighted that the first debate of this term to which I am contributing is on the important issue of drugs misuse. I thank Kenny MacAskill for bringing ...
Dr Simpson: Lab
The answer to the member's question about whether research has been done in this area is yes. The estimated number of children who are associated with drug-u...
Mike Pringle: LD
I take Richard Simpson's point and, like others, bow to his knowledge of the area, which is greater than mine.Trish Godman was absolutely right to make the p...
Bill Aitken (Glasgow) (Con): Con
I have found this debate encouraging. Not only have there been a lot of positive contributions in which members have drawn on their expertise from previous o...
Paul Martin (Glasgow Springburn) (Lab): Lab
I want to maintain the spirit of consensus, after one slight interruption. John Lamont said that Annabel Goldie raised the issue of drugs misuse even when it...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill): SNP
I thank colleagues from all parts of the chamber for their contributions to the debate. Many members spoke eloquently, passionately and, indeed, poignantly—s...