Chamber
Plenary, 27 Jun 2001
27 Jun 2001 · S1 · Plenary
Item of business
Serious Violent and Sexual Offenders
Like many members, I very much welcome the recommendations in the MacLean report and I thank the Executive for accepting them. The MacLean report will ensure that serious violent and sexual offenders are adequately monitored and that the risks that they pose to the public are significantly reduced. Although the report will be relevant only to a small number of offenders, we all know that it takes only a few men—we are talking mainly about men—to do an awful lot of damage to an awful lot of women and children. The report is therefore significant.
To enhance the MacLean report, the Executive should examine a specific matter. As convener of the cross-party group on men's violence against women and children, I invited ECPPAT—End Child Prostitution, Pornography and Trafficking—to give a presentation. I have spoken to ECPPAT representatives regarding legislation on sex offenders. Their main concerns are about convicted offenders who travel abroad, and about UK nationals and residents who have overseas convictions and who might fall through loopholes.
During their campaign, ECPPAT representatives made it perfectly clear to me and to the cross-party group that they felt that the work that they were doing was being side-tracked or forgotten about in Westminster. However, after coming to the Scottish Parliament, talking to many MSPs and holding a press conference, they felt that a new impetus had been given to their campaign. They wanted me to congratulate members of the Scottish Parliament, because they had come to the conclusion that, if Westminster did not act, Holyrood certainly would.
Most of what ECPPAT had campaigned for came into force on 1 June 2001. Now, sex offenders who travel abroad must notify the authorities about the country to which they are travelling, their point of arrival, their accommodation arrangements for the first night's overseas stay and their departure date. Of course, some of us would like to have notification of addresses for the duration of such people's time abroad, but that is a matter for another day and another time.
There is a loophole; UK nationals and residents who have overseas convictions are not covered by the MacLean report. I appreciate that that issue is partially covered in the Cosgrove report "Reducing the Risk: Improving the response to sex offending", and I hope that the MacLean and Cosgrove reports can be dovetailed in a fashion that will take care of the issue that I am outlining. A UK national or resident who has committed a string of sexual convictions abroad is at present immune to the new notification requirements and would still be immune if we were to implement the MacLean recommendations. Some who fit into the category of having committed crimes abroad are not included. If we are to reduce the risk of reoffending, we must include all those who are at risk of reoffending, and not just those who offend in this country.
I conclude by pleading with the minister to take on board my concerns. At the same time, however, I congratulate the Executive on introducing the white paper. I wish ministers every success in implementing it.
To enhance the MacLean report, the Executive should examine a specific matter. As convener of the cross-party group on men's violence against women and children, I invited ECPPAT—End Child Prostitution, Pornography and Trafficking—to give a presentation. I have spoken to ECPPAT representatives regarding legislation on sex offenders. Their main concerns are about convicted offenders who travel abroad, and about UK nationals and residents who have overseas convictions and who might fall through loopholes.
During their campaign, ECPPAT representatives made it perfectly clear to me and to the cross-party group that they felt that the work that they were doing was being side-tracked or forgotten about in Westminster. However, after coming to the Scottish Parliament, talking to many MSPs and holding a press conference, they felt that a new impetus had been given to their campaign. They wanted me to congratulate members of the Scottish Parliament, because they had come to the conclusion that, if Westminster did not act, Holyrood certainly would.
Most of what ECPPAT had campaigned for came into force on 1 June 2001. Now, sex offenders who travel abroad must notify the authorities about the country to which they are travelling, their point of arrival, their accommodation arrangements for the first night's overseas stay and their departure date. Of course, some of us would like to have notification of addresses for the duration of such people's time abroad, but that is a matter for another day and another time.
There is a loophole; UK nationals and residents who have overseas convictions are not covered by the MacLean report. I appreciate that that issue is partially covered in the Cosgrove report "Reducing the Risk: Improving the response to sex offending", and I hope that the MacLean and Cosgrove reports can be dovetailed in a fashion that will take care of the issue that I am outlining. A UK national or resident who has committed a string of sexual convictions abroad is at present immune to the new notification requirements and would still be immune if we were to implement the MacLean recommendations. Some who fit into the category of having committed crimes abroad are not included. If we are to reduce the risk of reoffending, we must include all those who are at risk of reoffending, and not just those who offend in this country.
I conclude by pleading with the minister to take on board my concerns. At the same time, however, I congratulate the Executive on introducing the white paper. I wish ministers every success in implementing it.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Sir David Steel):
NPA
The next item of business is the debate on motion S1M-2041, in the name of Mr Jim Wallace, on serious violent and sexual offenders, and an amendment to that ...
The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Justice (Mr Jim Wallace):
LD
I am pleased to move the motion today. First, it confirms that we have delivered on all of our programme for government commitment to"review the law by 2001 ...
Phil Gallie (South of Scotland) (Con):
Con
When reading this white paper, we have no choice but to go along with the stated aim of the minister: to make Scotland a safer place to live in. That is the ...
Mr Mike Rumbles (West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine) (LD):
LD
Will Phil Gallie give way?
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Patricia Ferguson):
Lab
The member is about to wind up.
Phil Gallie:
Con
I am sorry. I would have liked to take an intervention from Mike Rumbles.I have a number of other queries. One relates to the time that it may take to make a...
Roseanna Cunningham (Perth) (SNP):
SNP
As the lack of an SNP amendment to the motion suggests, I have no hesitation in welcoming the publication of the white paper on serious violent and sexual of...
Gordon Jackson (Glasgow Govan) (Lab):
Lab
It will come as no surprise to members to learn that I, too, welcome unreservedly the contents of the white paper. I have also been pleased to hear a degree ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Lab
No.
Gordon Jackson:
Lab
I am very sorry, but I thought I got a wee look.I always like to add a wee "but" just for the sake of it—old habits die hard. The white paper is a start, but...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Lab
For Mr Jackson's information, he will know when I am winding him up.
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow Kelvin) (Lab):
Lab
The debate has always been emotive and controversial. It concerns the most difficult offenders in our society. The debate is about creating safe communities....
Lord James Douglas-Hamilton (Lothians) (Con):
Con
Although the number of members in the chamber is somewhat depleted, there have been some extremely good speeches. Pauline McNeill was right to stress the imp...
Kay Ullrich (West of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
As many members know, in a previous existence, I spent many years working with victims of violent and sexual offending and with perpetrators of those awful c...
Donald Gorrie (Central Scotland) (LD):
LD
I would like to focus on one aspect of the excellent white paper. The paper tries to fulfil the recommendations of the MacLean committee and, on the technica...
Dr Richard Simpson (Ochil) (Lab):
Lab
I commend the Executive for the process so far of developing a modern approach to the difficult issue of serious violent and sexual offenders.The Minister fo...
Mr Gil Paterson (Central Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
Like many members, I very much welcome the recommendations in the MacLean report and I thank the Executive for accepting them. The MacLean report will ensure...
Bill Aitken (Glasgow) (Con):
Con
Sentencing is always a difficult issue, particularly when the crimes for which a sentence is being imposed are especially serious and sometimes horrific. The...
Roseanna Cunningham:
SNP
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I realise that this is a matter of convention, but does the fact that the Executive front benches are entirely empty ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Mr George Reid):
SNP
It is not for me to comment. It is a convention for ministers normally to be present during a debate and I am sure that civil servants or Government whips wi...
Elaine Smith (Coatbridge and Chryston) (Lab):
Lab
The Executive should be congratulated on bringing forward the white paper in line with the commitment in the programme for government and on accepting all th...
Stewart Stevenson (Banff and Buchan) (SNP):
SNP
Like Kay Ullrich, I bring personal experience to the debate, as I am a former psychiatric nurse who worked in a locked ward. I was 17 years old at the time; ...
Robert Brown (Glasgow) (LD):
LD
In this debate, we have seen the Scottish Parliament at its best. There is a kind of seminar atmosphere about the proceedings. I mean that in the highest sen...
Christine Grahame (South of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
The SNP welcomes these progressive proposals. We all hope that, once they are fleshed out, they will facilitate a balance between the release of those who ha...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
We are falling slightly short of time. I may have to suspend business for two or three minutes before 5 o'clock. We shall see.
Mrs Lyndsay McIntosh (Central Scotland) (Con):
Con
I am mindful of your concern about the timing, Presiding Officer, and I will try to as brief as I can.
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
The problem with the time is the other way round.
Mrs McIntosh:
Con
People have other places to go. I will not keep them any longer than I have to.We broadly accept the MacLean report findings and recommendations and we welco...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
Iain Gray will wind up for the Scottish Executive.You have 14 minutes, minister. If you just want to take your allotted 10 minutes, I will stop for three min...
The Deputy Minister for Justice (Iain Gray):
Lab
I am glad to have the opportunity today to discuss another aspect of the Scottish Executive's work that is aimed at protecting our communities. Managing the ...