Chamber
Plenary, 11 May 2000
11 May 2000 · S1 · Plenary
Item of business
Telecommunications
I listened with interest to the many excellent contributions throughout the debate. The debate has been marked by the consistently high quality of those contributions. I suspect that that is because members have read the Transport and the Environment Committee's recommendations and the Executive's interim response. I suspect that it is also because they have received a large number of letters over the first year of the Scottish Parliament. I am aware of the extent to which the issue has attracted significant public interest. Many members have written to me directly, as Minister for Transport and the Environment, so I know that there is strong interest in the subject.
I wish to take this opportunity to do three things: to give some insight into the thinking behind the Executive's response; to elaborate on some of those points; and to focus on where we go next—what the next steps are.
We will make a full response in due course. However, as I am sure everyone is aware, the related report from Sir William Stewart's independent expert group on mobile phones is extremely relevant to the issues that we are discussing. I want to ensure that, before we come to our final conclusions, we not only consider carefully the Transport and the Environment Committee's report, but consider in detail the Stewart report.
I do not propose to discuss each and every recommendation of both those reports—I do not have time. However, I wish to focus on the key issues that many members mentioned this morning.
A number of recommendations in the report of the Transport and the Environment Committee relate to extending planning controls over telecommunications installations and equipment. I acknowledge at the outset that there was limited support for the Executive's prior approval proposals from those who gave evidence to the committee. Andy Kerr made that point in his opening remarks. However, there was strong support for the introduction of full planning control from most of those who gave evidence to the committee. I understand the strong views of local communities and parents on the need for more advance warning of developments, more effective regulation and more accountability. Against that background, the Executive intends to move towards the committee's recommendations on that central issue, particularly in relation to planning controls over ground-based masts.
I wish to make it clear that it is not our intention severely to impede the industry from continuing to provide the people of Scotland and the Scottish economy with the undoubted benefits that mobile telecommunications offer in terms of business growth, e-commerce and economic efficiency. I have detected strong support across the chamber for an approach that supports the Scottish economy in an increasingly competitive global market.
Having said that, I stress that we will expect the industry to be more sensitive than it has sometimes appeared to be in the past. I will return to that point later, but there are obvious issues about mast sharing and providing information to local communities. Nick Johnston, Euan Robson, Elaine Smith and Bruce Crawford all spoke eloquently about those issues.
Not just the central belt and other large population centres will benefit from this fast-developing technology. It is particularly important for rural Scotland. Telecommunications infrastructure can help overcome many of the disadvantages associated with distance and remoteness. It can provide valuable opportunities for development in rural Scotland, which is an important priority for the Executive. I note the Transport and the Environment Committee's support for the extension of mobile coverage across Scotland. That point was addressed by Tavish Scott.
I wish to make it clear that, as we move towards the committee's recommendations, not every item of telecommunications equipment will be made subject to a specific application for planning permission. There is some equipment for which permitted development status might remain appropriate. However, before I announce any details on what will or will not require full planning control, or what will or will not be permitted development, I wish to ensure that we take the appropriate steps.
I wish to clarify a point made by David Mundell and Sylvia Jackson. If we extend planning control, it will cover road verges.
We want to liaise with the industry so that we are clear about its future development proposals; in fact, it will be in its interests to be more forthcoming about such proposals now that the recent licensing auction has been concluded. We need to know the nature and scale of the roll-out of new investment in telecommunications. Factors such as the number of sites, which areas are involved, whether there is more scope for mast sharing and future improvements in technology and design will be critical in shaping the future regulatory regime.
Furthermore, we also want to liaise with planning authorities on what they can do to prepare development plans and alterations to those plans, to provide a sound basis for the development of the industry while addressing environmental, amenity and other concerns. That will also enable input from communities.
I wish to take this opportunity to do three things: to give some insight into the thinking behind the Executive's response; to elaborate on some of those points; and to focus on where we go next—what the next steps are.
We will make a full response in due course. However, as I am sure everyone is aware, the related report from Sir William Stewart's independent expert group on mobile phones is extremely relevant to the issues that we are discussing. I want to ensure that, before we come to our final conclusions, we not only consider carefully the Transport and the Environment Committee's report, but consider in detail the Stewart report.
I do not propose to discuss each and every recommendation of both those reports—I do not have time. However, I wish to focus on the key issues that many members mentioned this morning.
A number of recommendations in the report of the Transport and the Environment Committee relate to extending planning controls over telecommunications installations and equipment. I acknowledge at the outset that there was limited support for the Executive's prior approval proposals from those who gave evidence to the committee. Andy Kerr made that point in his opening remarks. However, there was strong support for the introduction of full planning control from most of those who gave evidence to the committee. I understand the strong views of local communities and parents on the need for more advance warning of developments, more effective regulation and more accountability. Against that background, the Executive intends to move towards the committee's recommendations on that central issue, particularly in relation to planning controls over ground-based masts.
I wish to make it clear that it is not our intention severely to impede the industry from continuing to provide the people of Scotland and the Scottish economy with the undoubted benefits that mobile telecommunications offer in terms of business growth, e-commerce and economic efficiency. I have detected strong support across the chamber for an approach that supports the Scottish economy in an increasingly competitive global market.
Having said that, I stress that we will expect the industry to be more sensitive than it has sometimes appeared to be in the past. I will return to that point later, but there are obvious issues about mast sharing and providing information to local communities. Nick Johnston, Euan Robson, Elaine Smith and Bruce Crawford all spoke eloquently about those issues.
Not just the central belt and other large population centres will benefit from this fast-developing technology. It is particularly important for rural Scotland. Telecommunications infrastructure can help overcome many of the disadvantages associated with distance and remoteness. It can provide valuable opportunities for development in rural Scotland, which is an important priority for the Executive. I note the Transport and the Environment Committee's support for the extension of mobile coverage across Scotland. That point was addressed by Tavish Scott.
I wish to make it clear that, as we move towards the committee's recommendations, not every item of telecommunications equipment will be made subject to a specific application for planning permission. There is some equipment for which permitted development status might remain appropriate. However, before I announce any details on what will or will not require full planning control, or what will or will not be permitted development, I wish to ensure that we take the appropriate steps.
I wish to clarify a point made by David Mundell and Sylvia Jackson. If we extend planning control, it will cover road verges.
We want to liaise with the industry so that we are clear about its future development proposals; in fact, it will be in its interests to be more forthcoming about such proposals now that the recent licensing auction has been concluded. We need to know the nature and scale of the roll-out of new investment in telecommunications. Factors such as the number of sites, which areas are involved, whether there is more scope for mast sharing and future improvements in technology and design will be critical in shaping the future regulatory regime.
Furthermore, we also want to liaise with planning authorities on what they can do to prepare development plans and alterations to those plans, to provide a sound basis for the development of the industry while addressing environmental, amenity and other concerns. That will also enable input from communities.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Sir David Steel):
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S1M-803, in the name of Mr Andy Kerr, on behalf of the Transport and the Environment Committee, on that commi...
Mr Andy Kerr (East Kilbride) (Lab):
Lab
I am delighted to open this debate on behalf of the Transport and the Environment Committee. I thank my colleagues for their hard work in producing a thought...
Linda Fabiani (Central Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I am pleased to speak in this debate. The first report of the Transport and the Environment Committee is the result of a great deal of investigation. Committ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Patricia Ferguson):
Lab
I call Nick Johnston to open for the Conservatives. You have eight minutes, Mr Johnston.
Nick Johnston (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con):
Con
I will try to keep to my time.I stand here this morning as a warning to every young researcher or putative candidate to Parliament—never lodge a members' bus...
Tavish Scott (Shetland) (LD):
LD
I am grateful to Nick Johnston for clarifying the Conservative front-bench situation. For a terrible moment, those of us who enjoy transport and the environm...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Lab
We move to the open part of the debate. Members will have four minutes.
Elaine Smith (Coatbridge and Chryston) (Lab):
Lab
I am particularly pleased to take part in this debate, as I have been rather vocal on the subject of telecommunications developments since about June last ye...
Bruce Crawford (Mid Scotland and Fife) (SNP):
SNP
I would like to begin by congratulating the Transport and the Environment Committee on its work and on its report. I think that Andy Kerr did a good job of p...
Dr Sylvia Jackson (Stirling) (Lab):
Lab
I welcome constituents who have travelled to the Parliament from Strathblane and who have been going through an ordeal with a mast in their area. I thank the...
Euan Robson (Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (LD):
LD
I, too, welcome this report, with the important development that it proposes, and the Stewart report that was published today. There will be widespread agree...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab):
Lab
As a member of the Transport and the Environment Committee, I thank my fellow committee members and the staff of the committee for the tremendous amount of w...
Dr Richard Simpson (Ochil) (Lab):
Lab
I wonder if Des McNulty would agree that particular attention should be paid to masts near schools. Bruce Crawford shares my concern about the situation in K...
Des McNulty:
Lab
I am sympathetic to that view and that some of the income coming to local authorities in site rental should be used in that way.Monitoring health risks is a ...
Mr Murray Tosh (South of Scotland) (Con):
Con
I associate myself with all the positive remarks that have been made about the work of the staff on the Transport and the Environment Committee, and I congra...
Cathy Jamieson (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (Lab):
Lab
I welcome the Stewart committee's report, which was published today, and I am pleased to see that it vindicates many of the recommendations in the Transport ...
Robin Harper (Lothians) (Green):
Green
First, I apologise to the chamber because I must leave this debate early. I have a ceremony to attend at the University of Edinburgh in which I am playing a ...
Elaine Thomson (Aberdeen North) (Lab):
Lab
I am pleased to be taking part in this debate. I congratulate the Transport and the Environment Committee on a thorough and well-considered report. Telecom m...
Ian Jenkins (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
Carlops, in my constituency, is one of the most famous of the mobile phone mast episodes, but I do not wish to go into the details of that today as we are in...
Dr Simpson:
Lab
I appreciate what the member is going through. Perhaps I can offer some help. A mast was erected in my constituency. Fortunately, it was close to a B-listed ...
Ian Jenkins:
LD
I really do not want to go into the details because there are aspects of our discussions that might involve trees, or whatever.It seems totally unacceptable ...
Helen Eadie (Dunfermline East) (Lab):
Lab
I join other members in thanking sincerely the support team led by Lynn Tullis and all those who briefed us in the Transport and the Environment Committee an...
Janis Hughes (Glasgow Rutherglen) (Lab):
Lab
As a member of the Transport and the Environment Committee, I would like to echo the gratitude of my colleagues to the staff who have helped us through the i...
David Mundell (South of Scotland) (Con):
Con
I do not hold myself out to have the same expertise in these matters as my colleague Nick Johnston, but I was previously employed by British Telecommunicatio...
Mr Tosh:
Con
In the light of what Mr Mundell has just said, will he comment on the recommendation in the Stewart report that no one should be encouraged to use mobile tel...
David Mundell:
Con
Mr Tosh raises a very interesting point. If regulations are introduced, they should also apply to the use of car radios, as operating a car radio has been id...
Mr Kenny MacAskill (Lothians) (SNP):
SNP
As others such as Des McNulty have done, I put on record my thanks to the members of staff of the Transport and the Environment Committee. In many instances,...
Nick Johnston:
Con
Would Mr MacAskill be gracious enough—in the spirit of consensus that has evolved in the debate—to acknowledge that we are learning from experience, whereas ...
Mr MacAskill:
SNP
I should be happy to acknowledge that the Conservatives are learning from the past, although I would not go beyond that.The most important issue is to decide...
The Minister for Transport and the Environment (Sarah Boyack):
Lab
I listened with interest to the many excellent contributions throughout the debate. The debate has been marked by the consistently high quality of those cont...