Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 19 November 2025
19 Nov 2025 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Education
Doom and gloom have haunted the Scotland national men’s football team since we last qualified for the world cup in 1998, but last night they gave us all—a nation gripped with the possibility of what might be—a reason to believe again. Daring to dream, the Scotland men’s team have given the country more than a bit of hope today.
However, I am afraid that no such hope is invested in the Labour Party’s motion this afternoon. In fact, the motion might as well have quoted the words of the brilliant John McGinn, who, on leaving the pitch last night, declared:
“I thought we were pretty rubbish, to be honest.”
Labour’s motion has no ideas on how to improve our schools and, although I accept that there are challenges, I do not recognise the bleak picture of Scotland’s schools that has been painted for us today. There is a huge amount to celebrate.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Annabelle Ewing)
SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-19754, in the name of Pam Duncan-Glancy, on education. I invite members who wish to speak in the debate t...
Pam Duncan-Glancy (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
I apologise to members and, in particular to Bob Doris and Jamie Hepburn, for getting the two confused in my closing remarks in the previous debate.
Jamie Hepburn (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP)
SNP
Hear, hear!
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I am pleased to bring this debate to the chamber, which is motivated by my deep concern about the deteriorating learning and working environment in schools i...
The Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (Jenny Gilruth)
SNP
Doom and gloom have haunted the Scotland national men’s football team since we last qualified for the world cup in 1998, but last night they gave us all—a na...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
Did the cabinet secretary not hear the final minute—or minute and a half—of my speech, in which I outlined exactly what she and the Scottish Government could...
Jenny Gilruth
SNP
I direct the member to her motion, which mentions nothing positive about Scotland’s education system. However, there is a huge amount to be positive about in...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I appreciate the cabinet secretary being so generous and giving way again. Can she reflect on the fact that, for hundreds of schools across the country, the ...
Jenny Gilruth
SNP
I do not accept the point that the member makes. She has asked me several written questions on it; some of them pertain to private finance initiative schools...
Miles Briggs (Lothian) (Con)
Con
I start on a positive note by thanking the Labour Party for sponsoring a debate on education. It is important that we have those; in January, the Scottish Co...
Martin Whitfield (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
Did Miles Briggs take away from that conference the message that I took away from it—he has hinted that he did—which is that, without 100 per cent support fr...
Miles Briggs
Con
I did. That is why I wanted to touch on the issue, on which our school leaders are asking for support. We must ensure that the Parliament and the Government ...
Lorna Slater (Lothian) (Green)
Green
I am glad that the Labour Party has given us the opportunity to debate the situation in Scotland’s schools, although, frankly, I am depressed and disappointe...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD)
LD
Teachers and staff do some really good things in schools. They achieve an awful lot and transform young people’s lives, and we should recognise that. However...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
We move to the open debate, with speeches of up to four minutes from back benchers. 16:35
Paul Sweeney (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
I rise to raise in particular issues of spatial planning in schools. Glasgow is facing some significant challenges in that area. After many years of populati...
Bill Kidd (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP)
SNP
I thank Sarah Boyack, who is sitting down the front, for lodging the motion. Never mind that Bob Doris was not even in the room! I say to Pam Duncan-Glancy t...
Paul O’Kane (West Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I thank the Presiding Officer and all colleagues for the support that they have shown to me during my recent period of leave. Being a dad is the best job in ...
Roz McCall (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
I thank Labour for bringing the debate to the chamber on an afternoon that has focused on education and skills. I say at the outset that the issues in our ...
Martin Whitfield
Lab
We are talking about restorative practice. Is it not right to say that that approach works only once a person has developed the skills of empathy and of unde...
Roz McCall
Con
Yes—I could not agree more with that, at a certain level. However, the consequences have to be accepted not only by the pupil but by the parents, the teacher...
George Adam (Paisley) (SNP)
SNP
The cabinet secretary opened her speech by talking about Scotland’s men’s football team and the hope that they have given us all with the great result that t...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
We move to closing speeches. 16:57
Lorna Slater
Green
In my opening speech, I talked about the crushing workload challenges that teachers face as a result of the expansive and unnecessary bureaucracy that is bui...
Liz Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
In my teacher training course, the only thing that really mattered was how I could get on in front of a class. Forget all the theory, the coloured pencils, t...
Jenny Gilruth
SNP
I welcome the MSPs and parties who have come forward with solutions during the debate. We have just been hearing from Liz Smith, a fellow former teacher, abo...
Liz Smith
Con
I understand what the cabinet secretary is saying, but it is not all about money; it is about a cultural change that is required in our schools. As my collea...
Jenny Gilruth
SNP
I very much agree with Liz Smith’s points. In reflecting on our own teaching, we understand the importance of building trust with pupils and the class. That ...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab)
Lab
I am very much encouraged by the cabinet secretary’s points about data. Will she reflect on Lorna Slater’s point about co-ordinated support plans, which are ...
Jenny Gilruth
SNP
I hear Daniel Johnson’s point—Lorna Slater made a similar point. We have debated the issue at the Education, Children and Young People Committee. Co-ordinate...