Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 14 November 2023
14 Nov 2023 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Migration to Scotland: Scottish Government Proposals
I say to the minister that, instead of debating a paper on a hypothetical migration policy in the event of independence, what the Parliament should be debating and what her Government should be doing is answering the question of why not enough migrants come to Scotland. The most recent data that is available from the NRS shows that, in the year up to June 2021, Scotland’s net migration stood at 18,900 compared to a UK-wide net migration figure of 239,000. That is well below our population share.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur)
LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-11237, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, on building a new Scotland—migration to Scotland after independence....
The Minister for Independence (Jamie Hepburn)
SNP
Migration has had a hugely positive impact on Scotland throughout our history. We have been enriched by the contribution of those who have chosen to make Sco...
Paul Sweeney (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
Does the minister recognise that initiatives such as the ScotGrad scheme have been particularly effective not just in placing postgraduate students from an i...
Jamie Hepburn
SNP
I recognise that having specific schemes that are predicated on specific outcomes can make a difference, and I will come on to that in a few moments. Althou...
John Swinney (Perthshire North) (SNP)
SNP
On the population strategy and the focus of that work, does the minister acknowledge that there is a broad cross-section of opinion in Scotland that supports...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
I can give you the time back for that intervention, minister.
Jamie Hepburn
SNP
Yes, I recognise the point that Mr Swinney makes. Specific sectors and organisations make that point frequently. I know that Mr Swinney will encounter that i...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
A fine paper.
Jamie Hepburn
SNP
I can see that Mr Fraser is excited by that prospect. He will know that, in that paper, the Conservatives describe the migration shifts to our urban centres ...
Paul Sweeney
Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
Jamie Hepburn
SNP
Do I have time, Presiding Officer?
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
I can give you the time back, minister.
Paul Sweeney
Lab
I thank the minister for giving way. He has been very generous with his time. The minister mentioned the need to recruit health and social care workers, whi...
Jamie Hepburn
SNP
We will always consider what we can do within the powers that we have, but it would be far better if we had those powers in our hands in the first place, so ...
Donald Cameron (Highlands and Islands) (Con)
Con
I had a familiar sense of déjà vu while reading the Scottish Government’s motion ahead of today’s debate. Aside from the usual criticism of the UK Government...
Jamie Hepburn
SNP
The member suggests that this area is not a priority for the people of Scotland. Would he recognise that many of our public services, such as social care, an...
Donald Cameron
Con
Net migration has doubled—I will come on to that—but the real issue for the minister is why his Government has failed to improve those public services, given...
John Swinney
SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Donald Cameron
Con
I will continue. That £80,000 is on top of the £1.5 million that the Scottish Government allocates to civil servants who are working on its independence pro...
Kevin Stewart (Aberdeen Central) (SNP)
SNP
Will the member give way?
Donald Cameron
Con
Not at the moment. Although the sentiment might be welcome, the fact remains that Scotland’s rural population has been in free fall for some time and the Go...
The Minister for Equalities, Migration and Refugees (Emma Roddick)
SNP
I agree with the member that we could take more migrants; that is exactly what the Scottish Government is offering to do here and through responses to humani...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
Donald Cameron, I can give you the time back for the intervention.
Donald Cameron
Con
I say to the minister that, instead of debating a paper on a hypothetical migration policy in the event of independence, what the Parliament should be debati...
Ross Greer (West Scotland) (Green)
Green
Will the member take an intervention?
Donald Cameron
Con
No. I have already taken several. The reasons for that are many. It might be because Scotland is the highest-taxed part of the UK, with anyone who earns mor...
Paul O’Kane (West Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
Today, we have the opportunity to discuss issues of migration, including migration to, and internally within, Scotland. I welcome the chance to discuss how w...
Kate Forbes (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP)
SNP
In the spirit of looking for solutions to the issues that Paul O’Kane has rightly outlined, I note that Labour is keen to get the keys to number 10, so how w...
Paul O’Kane
Lab
I am grateful to Ms Forbes for her positive engagement and for sounding positive about the prospect of a Labour Government. I am about to come on to talk abo...
Jamie Hepburn
SNP
Will the member give way?