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Showing 60 of 2,096,445 contributions. Latest 30 days: 3,975. Coverage: 12 May 1999 — 11 Jun 2026.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
17:18
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
That concludes decision time.17:31The rest of this Official Report will be published progressively as soon as the text is available.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The final question is, that motion S7M-00346, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, on behalf of the Parliamentary Bureau, on committee membership, be agreed to.Motion agreed to,That the Parliament agrees the membership of committees of the Parliament as follows—Climate Action Committ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, as amended, is: For 67, Against 25, Abstentions 26.Motion, as amended, agreed to,That the Parliament welcomes that the...
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAdam, George (Paisley) (SNP)Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)Ahmed, Irshad (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Lab)Anderson, Heather (Dundee City West) (SNP)Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire West and Levern Valley) (SNP)Baillie, ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
Your vote has been recorded.
David Green (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (LD) LD Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I am sorry—I could not connect to the voting app. I would have abstained.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.The vote is closed.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The sixth question is, that motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, as amended, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.1, in the name of David Green, is: For 36, Against 67, Abstentions 16.Amendment disagreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForBannerman, Max (Highlands and Islands) (Reform)Baxter, Andrew (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (LD)Beresford, Senga (South Scotland) (Reform)Bland, Amanda (Central Scot and Lothians West) (Reform)Briggs, Miles (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Con)Carson, Finlay (Galloway and Wes...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
Your vote will be recorded.
Duncan Dunlop (South Scotland) (LD) LD Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I apologise—my vote was not recorded. I would have voted yes.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.The vote is closed.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The fifth question is, that amendment S7M-00309.1, in the name of David Green, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.5, in the name of Murdo Fraser, is: For 26, Against 91, Abstentions 0.Amendment disagreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForBannerman, Max (Highlands and Islands) (Reform)Beresford, Senga (South Scotland) (Reform)Bland, Amanda (Central Scot and Lothians West) (Reform)Briggs, Miles (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Con)Carson, Finlay (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con)Currie, Victor (Highlands and Is...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The next question is, that amendment S7M-00309.5, in the name of Murdo Fraser, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.2, in the name of Lorna Slater, is: For 66, Against 27, Abstentions 26.Amendment agreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAdam, George (Paisley) (SNP)Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)Anderson, Heather (Dundee City West) (SNP)Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire West and Levern Valley) (SNP)Barratt, David (Cowdenbeath) (SNP)Beattie, Colin (Midlothi...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The next question is, that amendment S7M-00309.2, in the name of Lorna Slater, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.4, in the name of Malcolm Offord, is: For 17, Against 92, Abstentions 9.Amendment disagreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForBannerman, Max (Highlands and Islands) (Reform)Beresford, Senga (South Scotland) (Reform)Bland, Amanda (Central Scot and Lothians West) (Reform)Currie, Victor (Highlands and Islands) (Reform)Kerr, Thomas (Glasgow) (Reform)Kirkwood, David (South Scotland) (Reform)Langan, Jam...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
I remind members that, if the amendment in the name of Malcolm Offord is agreed to, the amendment in the name of Murdo Fraser will fall.The next question is, that amendment S7M-00309.4, in the name of Malcolm Offord, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan M...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00309.3, in the name of Michael Marra, is: For 94, Against 15, Abstentions 9.Amendment agreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAdam, George (Paisley) (SNP)Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)Ahmed, Irshad (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Lab)Anderson, Heather (Dundee City West) (SNP)Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire West and Levern Valley) (SNP)Baillie, ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
Okay, thank you.
Lorna Slater (Edinburgh Central) (Green) Green Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
My apologies, Presiding Officer. That was left over from when the app was not working.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
We come to the vote on amendment S7M-00309.3, in the name of Michael Marra, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee. Members should cast their vote now.The vote is closed.We have a point of order from Lorna Slater.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division. There will be a short suspension to allow members to access the digital voting system.17:18Meeting suspended.17:21On resuming—
The Presiding Officer (Kenneth Gibson) NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There are seven questions to be put as a result of today’s business. The first question is, that amendment S7M-00309.3, in the name of Michael Marra, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00309, in the name of Ivan McKee, on public service reform and empowering staff, service users ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
The question on the motion will be put at decision time.
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
I hate to disappoint Ivan McKee, but his speech was not the last speech before the world cup. I will also undoubtedly disappoint other members given that we are looking to get out, but I will not take too long.Members will be aware that standing orders require the Parliamentar...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
Go on—why not?
The Minister for Parliamentary Business and Veterans (Jamie Hepburn) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
I will move and speak to the motion, Presiding Officer.
The Presiding Officer (Kenneth Gibson) NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Parliamentary Bureau Motion
The next item of business is consideration of Parliamentary Bureau motion S7M-00346, on committee membership. I ask Jamie Hepburn, on behalf of the Parliamentary Bureau, to move the motion.17:16
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
That concludes the debate on public service reform and empowering staff, service users and local communities.
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Does Mr Kerr want to intervene? I will get the time back, so I am happy to take his point. No, he does not. Okay.We have already saved more than £50 million on estates. I thought that it was 12, but we have now, in fact, shut 13 Scottish Government buildings. Murdo Fraser has ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Mr Kerr, you know to try to intervene rather than to attack from a sedentary position.
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I think that the confusion is more broad. The Reform manifesto talks about getting rid of all 130 public bodies—or “quangos”, as they call them. However, there is also a recognition from across the Reform benches that those public bodies—whether Police Scotland, the court syst...
Victor Currie (Highlands and Islands) (Reform) Reform Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Does the cabinet secretary recall that Max Bannerman’s point on community wind farms was that they do not rely on subsidies? Therefore, it forms no contradiction in Reform policy on our opposition to net zero.
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Yes. David Barratt also draws out the important point that the inconsistency in the Reform position is quite apparent. Reform members say in their amendment that we should not be talking about this stuff, and then they go on to talk about it from very different and contradicto...
David Barratt SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
—renewable energy schemes and for community-owned wind. Does the cabinet secretary agree that that is not the kind of reform that we need?
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Hello. It is not a speech within a speech. It is an intervention.
David Barratt SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
In moving the Reform amendment, Malcolm Offord stated that the Scottish Government should have no remit on net zero and energy, and he suggested cutting public bodies that are responsible for related areas. In contrast, Max Bannerman noted the value of community wind power in ...
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I will take David Barratt’s intervention, and then I will go on to talk about those other contributions.
David Barratt (Cowdenbeath) (SNP) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
In principle, we need stability of funding and to recognise the great work that happens in community organisations, which I see every week in my constituency. That work is absolutely critical, because those organisations are, to a large extent, the front line, and their abilit...
Bob Doris SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I commend the comments on the third sector that we have heard in the chamber this afternoon. I draw the cabinet secretary’s attention to the Social Justice and Social Security Committee’s report on funding of the third and voluntary sectors, and I highlight the longer-term fun...
Ivan McKee SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
On reflection, I am happy with the extent of the contributions that we have heard this afternoon. As I indicated at the outset, I was keen to hear from members, and that is what has happened for the most part. I will try to pick my way through the mind map that I have in front...
The Presiding Officer (Kenneth Gibson) NPA Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
Before I call the cabinet secretary, I say to members that, if they seek to make an intervention, they should remember to stand up and ask to make an intervention. I notice that buttons are pressed but, sometimes, the speakers do not see who is trying to intervene.17:05
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Clare Adamson) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
We move to the open debate.15:58
Alyn Smith (Stirling) (SNP) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I congratulate Ivan McKee—I will call him super Ivan, given the scale of his task, based on his speech and the vision that he has set out today.From listening to colleagues from across the chamber, I am struck that there is a lot of common ground here, and I think that we need...
David Green (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (LD) LD Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I begin by welcoming the cabinet secretary to his new role and wishing him well. As we have already heard, Mr McKee has been handed what might become the defining task of this Government, which is tackling the £5 billion black hole in Scotland’s finances. As Murdo Fraser has j...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Clare Adamson) SNP Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I call Murdo Fraser, who joins us online.15:47
Michael Marra Lab Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I point gently to the fact that Alyn Smith’s party had an outright majority in the Parliament for one of those parliamentary sessions, so not having had the numbers is not a foolproof excuse.Alyn Smith will find common ground across different areas. My note of caution to him w...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con Chamber
11 Jun 2026
Public Service Reform (Staff, Service Users and Local Communities)
I should explain that I am having to contribute remotely today due to a family issue; otherwise, I would be in the chamber.I welcome Ivan McKee to his new role as Cabinet Secretary for Public Service Reform. I know that he is keen to dispel the notion that he is here as an axe...
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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 28 June 2023

28 Jun 2023 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill

I am aware that the bill has been opposed by every political party in Northern Ireland, including the Democratic Unionist Party, and key stakeholders such as Amnesty International, Relatives for Justice and WAVE—Widows Against Violence Empower—Trauma Centre, the latter being the largest cross-community victim group in Northern Ireland.

The Scottish Government advised the Scottish Parliament to refuse consent on the bill on 20 October 2022 when the first legislative consent memorandum was lodged. The majority of the Criminal Justice Committee voted to support that position when the committee published its first report on the bill on 10 January 2023, with two members voting against the Scottish Government’s recommendation.

Since then, the UK Government has proposed further amendments to the bill, the most recent of which it published and provided in full to the Scottish Government only on 8 June. We have considered those new amendments, and it is the position of the Scottish Government—which includes the Lord Advocate and the Solicitor General for Scotland—that the recent amendments do not resolve the concerns that resulted in the recommendation that the Parliament should not pass a legislative consent motion on the bill.

In its current form, despite the amendments that were tabled by the UK Government, the bill still gives rise to three key areas of concern for the Scottish Government, of which I apprised the Criminal Justice Committee on 21 June. First, it will limit the ability of victims of the troubles to seek justice through Scottish courts if required. Secondly, it does not respect devolution and provides power to the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland to amend devolved legislation without first discussing the matter with, or obtaining consent from, this Parliament. Thirdly, it has the potential to impact on the powers of the Lord Advocate as independent head of the systems of criminal prosecution and the investigation of deaths in Scotland. The Criminal Justice Committee published its final report on the bill on 23 June, with no members voting against the Scottish Government’s recommendation to withhold consent.

In its current form, the bill still allows the granting of immunity to people who apply for it, even though they might have committed serious offences during the troubles. In effect, it could mean an amnesty for those who have committed offences such as murder or crimes involving abuse and torture, including crimes that were conducted by agents of the state. The amendments will not increase the opportunity for people who have been directly affected by the troubles and are seeking justice to obtain justice or ensure that people who committed offences during the troubles are appropriately held to account.

In its current form, the bill provides the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland with the ability to amend devolved legislation without having to make the Scottish Government aware of that, let alone seek the Scottish Parliament’s agreement to do so. If the UK Government respects devolution, it should not exercise powers within the legislative competence of the Scottish Parliament unless doing so is specifically agreed.

Even with the concessions that have been made by the UK Government, the bill continues to encroach on the role of the Lord Advocate as the independent head of the systems of criminal prosecution and the investigation of deaths in Scotland. The principle that the Lord Advocate takes decisions in their capacity as head of the systems of prosecution and the investigation of deaths independently of any other body predates devolution and is protected by section 48(5) of the Scotland Act 1998. The power to grant immunity that is proposed for the independent commission that will be created by the UK Government’s bill potentially undermines that principle by adversely impacting on the Lord Advocate’s ability to take decisions on whether to commence prosecutions.

As I laid out to the Criminal Justice Committee last week, under previous iterations of the bill, it was the case that, even when immunity was not granted, the Lord Advocate would not be able to commence a prosecution unless and until the commission decided to formally refer the cases to the Lord Advocate’s office. Therefore, I welcome the amendment that has been proposed by the UK Government, which will mean that the Lord Advocate can direct the commission to refer such a case to the Lord Advocate’s office when it is considered appropriate. I understand that the Solicitor General met Lord Caine to discuss that amendment. However, as I already stated to the Criminal Justice Committee, at the heart of the bill is the power given to the commission to grant immunity from prosecution for the most serious of offences.

In Scotland, we would expect the power to make decisions on which individuals should be prosecuted to be exercised by the Lord Advocate acting independently in the public interest. Despite the recent amendments to the bill, the commission’s power to grant immunity still has the potential to cut across the independent decision making of the Lord Advocate. In effect, the commission, and not the Lord Advocate, will have the discretion to decide whether a prosecution can be raised. The Scottish Government does not think that it is wise or appropriate for the UK Government to alter the Lord Advocate’s constitutional position in that way and, in my view, it is not something that the Scottish Parliament should consent to.

The Scottish Government has a responsibility to review UK Government legislation that will impact on the devolved powers of this Parliament and to review any amendments that are made to it. We have done so, and it is our recommendation that the Parliament maintains its position of withholding legislative consent to the amended Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill. Therefore, I urge all members to support that position, which is backed by the Scottish Parliament’s Criminal Justice Committee.

I move,

That the Parliament agrees with the recommendation in the Scottish Government’s supplementary legislative consent memorandum to withhold consent for the UK Government’s Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill.

15:25  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-09722, in the name of Angela Constance, on the Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice and Home Affairs (Angela Constance) SNP
This is an opportunity for the Parliament to consider a supplementary legislative consent motion on the UK Government’s Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and...
Maggie Chapman (North East Scotland) (Green) Green
The cabinet secretary has outlined the principles of the bill. What conversations did the Scottish Government manage to have with those on the ground in Nort...
Angela Constance SNP
I am aware that the bill has been opposed by every political party in Northern Ireland, including the Democratic Unionist Party, and key stakeholders such as...
Russell Findlay (West Scotland) (Con) Con
I grew up with the troubles on my television screen. For families in Northern Ireland, it was their lives. Today, it can be easy for us to forget the daily b...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
We all need to be very careful in how we talk about and consider this issue. I want to make the following point. On 20 July 1982, four soldiers from my regi...
Russell Findlay Con
I thank Edward Mountain for his intervention. I know that, as a former soldier, he knows more than most the extent of the troubles and the horrors that they ...
Keith Brown (Clackmannanshire and Dunblane) (SNP) SNP
I do not know whether Russell Findlay heard what the cabinet secretary said, but all the parties in Northern Ireland believe that the bill undermines the rig...
Russell Findlay Con
There are many views about the legislation in Northern Ireland and across the United Kingdom, but it is vitally important that a UK-wide approach is taken. T...
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
The Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill proposes an effective amnesty from prosecution for troubles-related offences in exchange for c...
Paul O’Kane (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I am grateful to Pauline McNeill for giving way. She knows of my deep personal interest in the issue—indeed, she will note that I had the great honour of hos...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I can give you the time back, Ms McNeill.
Pauline McNeill Lab
I agree whole-heartedly with Paul O’Kane that, although the substance of the debate is about whether we give legislative consent to the bill because it cuts ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I call the cabinet secretary to wind up the debate, for around five minutes. 15:36
Angela Constance SNP
The Government recognises the great sensitivity of the matters that we are discussing today, and it has proceeded on that basis at all times. In essence, the...
Russell Findlay Con
Will the cabinet secretary give way?
Angela Constance SNP
No, thank you. In our view, that has the potential to adversely impact the long-standing position of the Lord Advocate. The bill—
Edward Mountain Con
Will the cabinet secretary give way?
Angela Constance SNP
No, I will not, Mr Mountain. Okay—yes, I will.
Edward Mountain Con
I am very grateful. Some people who have already been prosecuted have got letters, known as “on the run” letters, from a previous UK Government, which allow ...
Angela Constance SNP
Mr Mountain, I am trying very hard not to have a politicised debate, given the matters that we are discussing. I am aware of the sensitivity of the issues fo...