Holyrood, made browsable

Hansard

Every contribution to the Official Report — chamber and committee — searchable in one place. Pulled from data.parliament.scot, indexed for full-text search, linked through to every MSP.

129
Current MSPs
415
MSPs ever elected
14
Parties on record
2,095,827
Hansard contributions
1999–2026
Coverage span
Official Report

Search Hansard contributions

Showing 60 of 2,095,827 contributions. Latest 30 days: 3,357. Coverage: 12 May 1999 — 10 Jun 2026.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
That concludes decision time.18:01Members’ business will be published tomorrow, 11 June 2026, as soon as the text is available.The rest of this Official Report will be published progressively as soon as the text is available.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on motion S7M-00294, in the name of Anas Sarwar, on an inquiry to restore public trust in Scottish politics, as amended, is: For 71, Against 50, Abstentions 0.Motion, as amended, agreed to,That the Parliament believes there is a need to restore publi...
Speaker unknown Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAdam, George (Paisley) (SNP)Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)Ahmed, Irshad (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Lab)Anderson, Heather (Dundee City West) (SNP)Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire West and Levern Valley) (SNP)Barratt, ...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
Your vote has been recorded.
Joe Long (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I was unable to vote. I would have voted no.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
Your vote has been recorded.
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Local Government (Jenny Gilruth) SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. My app would not connect. I would have voted yes.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.The vote is closed.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The final question is, that motion S7M-00294, in the name of Anas Sarwar, on an inquiry to restore public trust in Scottish politics, as amended, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00294.3, in the name of Russell Findlay, is: For 53, Against 70, Abstentions 0.Amendment disagreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAhmed, Irshad (Edinburgh and Lothians East) (Lab)Baillie, Jackie (Dumbarton) (Lab)Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)Bannerman, Max (Highlands and Islands) (Reform)Baxter, Andrew (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (LD)Beresford, Senga (South Scotland) (Reform)Bibby, Neil...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The next question is, that amendment S7M-00294.3, in the name of Russell Findlay, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00294, in the name of Anas Sarwar, on an inquiry to restore public trust in Scottish politics, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00294.2, in the name of Ross Greer, is: For 70, Against 53, Abstentions 0.Amendment agreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAdam, George (Paisley) (SNP)Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)Anderson, Heather (Dundee City West) (SNP)Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire West and Levern Valley) (SNP)Barratt, David (Cowdenbeath) (SNP)Beattie, Colin (Midlothi...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The next question is, that amendment S7M-00294.2, in the name of Ross Greer, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00294, in the name of Anas Sarwar, on an inquiry to restore public trust in Scottish politics, be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
The result of the division on amendment S7M-00294.1, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, is: For 55, Against 68, Abstentions 0.Amendment disagreed to.
Speaker unknown Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
ForAdam, George (Paisley) (SNP)Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)Anderson, Heather (Dundee City West) (SNP)Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire West and Levern Valley) (SNP)Barratt, David (Cowdenbeath) (SNP)Beattie, Colin (Midlothi...
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
We move to the vote on amendment S7M-00294.1, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, which seeks to amend motion S7M-00294, in the name of Anas Sarwar. Members should cast their votes now.
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There will be a division.There will be a short suspension to allow members to access the digital voting system.17:53Meeting suspended.17:55On resuming—
The Presiding Officer (Kenneth Gibson) NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
There are four questions to be put as a result of today’s business.I remind members that, if the amendment in the name of Jamie Hepburn is agreed to, the amendment in the name of Ross Greer will fall.The first question is, that amendment S7M-00294.1, in the name of Jamie Hepbu...
Speaker unknown Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Decision Time
17:53
The Presiding Officer (Kenneth Gibson) NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Business Motion
The next item of business is consideration of business motion S7M-00301, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, on behalf of the Parliamentary Bureau, setting out a business programme.Motion moved,That the Parliament agrees—(a) the following programme of business—Tuesday 16 June 20262....
Speaker unknown Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Business Motion
17:52
The Presiding Officer NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
That concludes the debate on an inquiry to restore public trust in Scottish politics.
Jackie Baillie Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
The minister misunderstands and is clearly not listening. The people of Scotland are interested in those wider questions, but that is not what I am suggesting the inquiry should do. I have been very clear on that point.Let me go back to what Robin McAlpine had to say about dem...
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
I find it interesting that, although Ms Baillie said that it is not for others to take an interest in the SNP’s internal affairs, she is now talking extensively about the appointment of a KC and the thin nature of our internal governance review. It seems that she is taking an ...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
The key and absolute qualification for any First Minister of Scotland is that“that individual must be able to command the trust of the Parliament and the public.”—Official Report, 28 November 2001; c 4118.Those are not my words but those of John Swinney and, on that point, we ...
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
No, I do not, so let us move on.The point that I was going to make was one that I made earlier: it is important that, as an institution, we focus on matters that are of primary interest and of paramount importance to the people of Scotland. Instead of raising issues like this,...
Russell Findlay Con Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
I remember how sleazy, arrogant and entitled Labour became when it dominated Scottish politics. Does the minister see that at all in his party?
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
I will give way to Mr Findlay.
Russell Findlay Con Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Will the member give way?
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
: —that the SNP has won five elections in a row. It has earned the trust of the people for five elections in a row. It is just a matter of fact—there is no arrogance about it; it is just a reality.I think that it is important that we—
The Presiding Officer (Kenneth Gibson) NPA Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Please speak through the chair.
Anas Sarwar Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
It was the mindset that Murrell had.
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
It is not a mindset but a matter of fact—
Anas Sarwar Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
That is your mindset.
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
There are two things there. First, the public can be confident that the crime that has been perpetrated has been fully investigated and prosecuted and there is now a plea. I do not think that any of us is suggesting that there is a lack of confidence in that process—I certainl...
Willie Rennie LD Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
That is a very generous offer, but I will have to decline.The minister is talking about the SNP investigating itself. How does that improve the confidence of the public in the Government party in this country?
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
I do not think that Mr Rennie is one of those SNP members, but maybe he wants to apply to join—we might let him come on board.I will give way one more time, to Mr Rennie.
Willie Rennie LD Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Will the minister give way?
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
That brings me to a point that I was going to make later, because it picks up on a point that Willie Rennie made—I see that Mr Rennie is now paying attention to me. He made the point that my party does not want to do anything in response to some of the issues that have arisen ...
Daniel Johnson Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
The minister does not want to accept questions coming from other parts of the chamber. Does he accept that questions are also coming from people who served his party, both in the NEC and in Parliaments? Those people are saying that blocks and obstructions were put in the way o...
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
I will give way one more time.
Daniel Johnson Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Will the minister give way?
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
That was a wonderful pre-prepared line delivered tremendously well, Ms Lindsay. We look forward to much more of that.The past few weeks have been uncomfortable, difficult and very distressing for many of us—I will not pretend otherwise. No one would believe me if I did. Howeve...
Amanda Lindsay Reform Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
The only thing that I would say in response to that is that the SNP lecturing Reform on sleaze is like Lord Mandelson selling ethics lessons. No one is buying it.
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
I say to Amanda Lindsay that I might take more seriously the notion that my party operated like a syndicate if her party was not one that had been formed as a private limited company that is owned by one individual. Let us just remember where we are all starting from. Interrup...
Amanda Lindsay Reform Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Yet, when it comes to holding one of its own to account for embezzling party funds, the urgency mysteriously disappears.Meanwhile, Scottish Labour, which called this debate, might want to reflect on its party’s sleazy history. After all, its hero, Lord Mandelson, was twice for...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
The member must be heard.
Amanda Lindsay Reform Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Instead of full transparency, we have had silence, deflection and obstruction. The First Minister likes to lecture others about integrity, yet he still refuses to put country before party. If he truly believes in restoring public trust, he must stop hiding behind lawyers and f...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
No, no, minister. The member does not have to take interventions.
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Ah, come on!
Amanda Lindsay Reform Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Forgive me, but I wish to make progress.
Jamie Hepburn SNP Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Will the member give way?
Amanda Lindsay (Central Scot and Lothians West) (Reform) Reform Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
I support this debate and back calls for a full parliamentary inquiry into the shocking embezzlement of party funds by Peter Murrell.The Scottish people deserve the truth. For years, the SNP has presented itself as a slick, professional political machine. In reality, it has op...
Patrick Harvie Green Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
I think that Anas Sarwar would be horrified if a former or a current leader of a political party told its members how they should vote on a committee decision. Interruption. That is for committees to decide, and I am not going to instruct any—Interruption. Look at him laughing...
Anas Sarwar Lab Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
Mr Harvie says that committees in this Parliament could investigate certain prosecutions. To clarify, if a motion came to the justice committee, would his party support such an investigation by the justice committee?
Patrick Harvie (Glasgow) (Green) Green Chamber
10 Jun 2026
Public Trust in Scottish Politics
I beg your pardon, Presiding Officer. I was just discovering how much some speeches improve when I remove my hearing aids.Sadly, today, we have very much seen the debate that I expected. There has been some opportunistic partisanship dressed up as principled concern, and there...
← Back to list
Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 06 November 2019

06 Nov 2019 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Curriculum for Excellence
Smith, Liz Con Mid Scotland and Fife Watch on SPTV

When the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development produced its very important and comprehensive report on Scottish education in 2015, it prioritised some key recommendations. The report was very clear that the principles that underlie curriculum for excellence are the rights ones, and that the twin ambitions of excellence and equity should underpin all aspects of education policy. It also had many good things to say about the approach to holistic learning. Those are the exactly the reasons why all parties in Parliament agreed with Peter Peacock, the Minister for Education and Young People at the time, that curriculum for excellence was the right approach for the 21st century.

However, the report also warned that significant challenges existed in respect of delivery of curriculum for excellence. It highlighted both the absolute and relative decline in some aspects of attainment—mathematics being its primary focus—expressed concern about the higher incidence of lower achievement among secondary pupils compared with previous standards, and about the difficulty of evaluating curriculum for excellence because there was insubstantial research and incomplete data. On that last point, it recommended strengthening

“evaluation and research, including independent knowledge”,

which was not helped, of course, by Scottish Government actions to remove Scotland from some key international measurements.

Therefore, let me use an evidence-based approach in the debate. There is no doubt that curriculum for excellence was designed to build on the widely acknowledged strengths of Scottish education, and to ensure that schools would be fit for the 21st century. I agree with the Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills when he says that that demands a change of culture and a different approach in our thinking, such that we are not wedded to old theories and practice. However, that should never become the excuse just to move on and hope that by adopting a new culture, the current problems of Scottish education will be solved.

Curriculum for excellence is about far more than just exams and the traditional measures of attainment, but those traditional measures still matter, just as they do in any education system anywhere in the world.

The cabinet secretary often cites the increase in the number of new qualifications that are available to young people as justification for claiming success for curriculum for excellence, but that must surely be set alongside what is happening to the core qualifications that parents, young people and employers will always see as being important for job prospects. It is undoubtedly true that there has been a very considerable increase in the number of new qualifications, but the increase remains much smaller than the extent of the fall in the numbers who are sitting core qualifications.

Our serious educationists in Scotland—including Mark Priestley, Lindsay Paterson, Keir Bloomer and Jim Scott—have examined the facts using the evidence-based approach that the OECD claimed was needed so much. In short, those specialists have, through their painstaking efforts, provided us with a very considerable bank of evidence about developments in Scottish education over the past decade—evidence that shows that, despite all the past strengths of Scottish education, there are some deeply worrying trends in the current system.

The biggest concerns are, first, that attainment in the core subjects has varied across the picture. The facts—including evidence that was presented to the Education and Skills Committee—show that there has been a very marked downward shift in subject choices away from science, technology, engineering and mathematics, languages and social subjects, to the extent that some subjects are approaching very serious problems for their sustainability in the future—to say nothing of the negative effects that that would have on the economy.

Secondly, even after taking into consideration structural and demographic changes, there has been a significant decline in attainment in several key areas of literacy and numeracy.

The third area of great concern relates to Professor Jim Scott’s latest evidence, which highlights the fact that the least-able pupils are losing out most. For Scottish Conservative members, that is the key concern, given that curriculum for excellence was supposed to help that pupil cohort most. I will return to that point in a minute.

All the time, however, John Swinney and Nicola Sturgeon are very keen on telling us that attainment is improving and that exam results are getting better, but that is simply not a fully accurate picture.

If the cabinet secretary will not listen to me, he must surely listen to his own advisers. We know that civil servants produced a paper on 2 August in which concerns about the issue were raised. One of his officials told him:

“I am concerned about the drop in the overall Higher pass rate (down 2 percentage points) and in relation to English (down 2.7 percentage points) and mathematics (down 2.1 percentage points) in particular.”

We also know that, when the Scottish Qualifications Authority results were published, the officials were proved right. But what did Mr Swinney say when it was revealed that 2019 was the fourth year of falling attainment in highers—the so-called gold standard of Scottish education? Mr Swinney said that the summer results were

“a strong set of results”

and that he was not too concerned about “annual variation”.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Christine Grahame) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-19717, in the name of Liz Smith, on curriculum for excellence. 15:55
Liz Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
When the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development produced its very important and comprehensive report on Scottish education in 2015, it priori...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (John Swinney) SNP
I wonder how Liz Smith would describe a 75 per cent higher pass rate? Does she not consider that to be a strong performance by the young people of Scotland?
Liz Smith Con
I think that Mr Swinney should listen to what his civil servants have been telling him about their concerns about the downturn in the highers pass rate. That...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I call John Swinney to speak to and move amendment S5M-19717.1. I beg your pardon—I mean S5M-19717.2. You were about to move the Labour amendment, cabinet se...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (John Swinney) SNP
I would have been unable to move the dismal words of the Labour amendment. I will, however, move the amendment in my name, which you properly ascribed to me....
Liz Smith Con
Will the cabinet secretary give way?
John Swinney SNP
I will give way in a second. Let me first put some details on the record. The gap for those achieving at least one pass or more at level 5—such as national ...
Liz Smith Con
Professor Jim Scott’s analysis, which was published earlier this week, deals with the issue methodically—school by school and local authority by local author...
John Swinney SNP
I was coming to discussion of the analysis that Professor Scott issued this week, because Liz Smith’s motion refers to it, and she referred to it in her comm...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
John Swinney SNP
I will continue, if Mr Johnson will forgive me. Around a fifth of leavers left with a course award—for example, a national 2 award, an employability award, ...
Iain Gray (East Lothian) (Lab) Lab
I rise to support the motion and to speak to the far from dismal amendment in my name. I congratulate Liz Smith on bringing the debate to the chamber. In tr...
The Presiding Officer (Ken Macintosh) NPA
Could you conclude, please, Mr Gray?
Iain Gray Lab
It is critical that the review moves forward quickly. I move amendment SM5-19717.1, to insert after “delivery of CfE”: “recognises that such failures have ...
Ross Greer (West Scotland) (Green) Green
I thank Liz Smith for bringing the topic for debate. Like Iain Gray, I am frustrated that, once again, we are debating education during Opposition time alone...
Beatrice Wishart (Shetland Islands) (LD) LD
Here were are again—another Opposition-led debate on the state of Scotland’s education system. I thank the Conservatives for giving us the opportunity to deb...
Dr Alasdair Allan (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) SNP
I appreciate that any individual teacher is entitled to their view, but the member says that she regards that as a “useful” contribution. Does she really thi...
Beatrice Wishart LD
As I said, I do not agree with the description, but I was coming on to make the point that it is useful to think of it in another way, which is that curricul...
Alison Harris (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
The motion is focused on the weaknesses in the delivery of the curriculum for excellence and the real effect that those are having on Scotland’s children. Th...
Clare Adamson (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) SNP
Like many members, I took very seriously the Education and Skills Committee’s concerns when it undertook its inquiry into subject choice, but I do not think ...
Jenny Marra (North East Scotland) (Lab) Lab
Will the member give way?
Clare Adamson SNP
I think that I am out of time.
The Presiding Officer NPA
Yes, I am afraid that you are. 16:29
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
I will follow on from where the convener of the Education and Skills Committee left off. She is right that it is vital that we look at the curriculum for exc...
The Presiding Officer NPA
Please conclude, Mr Johnson.
Daniel Johnson Lab
We need to understand how we are achieving. We need to have confidence in the measurements that we have of our education system. 16:34
Rona Mackay (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) SNP
I welcome this opportunity to discuss curriculum for excellence, and in particular the work that the Government is doing to close the attainment gap across S...
Liz Smith Con
Does the member agree with the work that Professor Jim Scott has published? He made painstaking efforts to ensure that the evidence that he produced was accu...
Rona Mackay SNP
I understand that Professor Scott carried out a great deal of detailed work. I cannot say for sure whether it is 100 per cent accurate. We can throw statisti...