Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 08 June 2016
08 Jun 2016 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Named Person Policy
Mr Stevenson makes an interesting point.
Let me develop the point about the named person. What is so difficult about the named person legislation is the definition of the term “wellbeing”. We warned about that when the bill went through Parliament. We listened to the legal experts, who said at the time that “wellbeing” is very difficult to define.
In the last parliamentary debate on the subject, I well remember my colleague Alex Johnstone seeking clarification from Stewart Maxwell, the then convener of Education and Culture Committee, about what he understood to be the definition of “wellbeing”, only to be told that his intervention was ridiculous and that, if that was the level of debate from the Tories, it was deeply regrettable. However, the question is very serious, and it needs to be answered.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Linda Fabiani)
SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-00345, in the name of Liz Smith, on education. I am speaking slowly to allow Ms Smith to get herself orga...
Liz Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
I draw members’ attention to the first line in the motion, in which I make it clear that this afternoon’s debate is not about whether members support the Sco...
The Minister for Childcare and Early Years (Mark McDonald)
SNP
Liz Smith has mentioned the RCN. She will have seen the briefing that the RCN issued last night, which says that it is neither calling for the policy to be s...
Liz Smith
Con
Yes, I will—I have done so already. However, the RCN is on record saying that it wants greater resources, and many people inside the RCN who have come to see...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab)
Lab
Will the member give way?
Liz Smith
Con
Let me make a little progress. Jenny Laing, of Aberdeen City Council, made a similar comment, and today, Dr Simon Knight, who is a senior youth practitioner...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)
SNP
Is the member aware that, on 24 March, in the House of Commons Public Bill Committee on the Investigatory Powers Bill, my colleague Joanna Cherry MP elicited...
Liz Smith
Con
Mr Stevenson makes an interesting point. Let me develop the point about the named person. What is so difficult about the named person legislation is the de...
Daniel Johnson
Lab
It is good to hear that the Conservatives are concerned about resources and definitions, but I thought—indeed, in recent articles Ruth Davidson has said—that...
Liz Smith
Con
Nothing has changed. We remain completely opposed to the policy, but the debate—Interruption. Members can say all that they like, but as we indicate in our m...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP)
SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Liz Smith
Con
I will not at this stage; I have taken three interventions and I want to make some progress. The First Minister has confused the issue. She says that engage...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (John Swinney)
SNP
When the Parliament passed the Children and Young People (Scotland) Act 2014 on 19 February 2014, we recognised that a policy that had been developed and tes...
Liz Smith
Con
Will the cabinet secretary outline why he thinks there is so much opposition to the policy? Within many of the professional groups—Interruption. I will not r...
John Swinney
SNP
There are two issues in Liz Smith’s comment. One is the issue about workload, to which I will come. We have to take that into account, which is why my amendm...
Adam Tomkins (Glasgow) (Con)
Con
Surely the difference between a GP and a named person is that a GP is there to assist, whereas a named person is there not only to assist but—behind the back...
John Swinney
SNP
That intervention characterises why this debate has become what it has become—because Mr Tomkins has fuelled the absurdity of the attacks that were made on t...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
Quiet, please.
Liz Smith
Con
Will the SNP be supporting the Labour amendment?
John Swinney
SNP
I will be supporting my own amendment—I drafted it, so I will be voting for it. I do not think that that was a great moment of parliamentary triumph. What e...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
I call Tavish Scott to speak to and move amendment S5M-00345.1.1 to amendment S5M-00345.1. 15:36
Tavish Scott (Shetland Islands) (LD)
LD
Thank you, Presiding Officer, for that lengthy introduction. This morning, I read the papers on the named person policy. I am at a loss to understand why a ...
Brian Whittle (South Scotland) (Con)
Con
I declare an interest as a member of the west of Scotland National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children board. We are speaking to practicality ...
Tavish Scott
LD
I am not the minister with responsibility for the policy, but it is clear that it would be wrong to have three named people for any individual in such circum...
Iain Gray (East Lothian) (Lab)
Lab
Scottish Labour supported the principle of the named person scheme when it was legislated for, and we continue to believe that, implemented properly and prop...
Liz Smith
Con
I am sure that Iain Gray will acknowledge that other professionals—people in Unison, the EIS and the SSTA—hold a very different view of that case load.
Iain Gray
Lab
That view is largely related to the resources going into their professions and the authorities for which they work generally, and I will come to that point. ...
Mark McDonald
SNP
Iain Gray will be aware that the children’s commissioner was explicitly asked about that during the election campaign and said that he did not agree that the...
Iain Gray
Lab
That is the suggestion that we made at the time and I would like to be consistent with it, but we are not wedded to it. I simply say that we think that there...
Liz Smith
Con
Will the member give way?