Committee
Rural Affairs, Climate Change and Environment Committee 11 March 2015
11 Mar 2015 · S4 · Rural Affairs, Climate Change and Environment Committee
Item of business
Community Empowerment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2
I will be brief. I absolutely agree with Mike Russell and Sarah Boyack that section 48 is the core of the bill. It is also important to put it on the record that it is the only area of the bill on which there was not unanimous agreement in the committee’s stage 1 report. When the minister gave evidence, I asked her to confirm what the policy memorandum states—that the powers under section 48 would be used only as a last resort—and, if I recall correctly, she confirmed that that is the case. I can quite happily support that in principle. What concerns me about Mike Russell’s amendment 34—although I understand that he is likely not to move it at this stage—is that I do not believe that it provides the clarity that the bill requires. Good law is clear, unambiguous and properly defined, and I am concerned that his amendment would take us into areas that require interpretation and definition. A definition of sustainable development is a bit like beauty—sometimes it is in the eye of the beholder and very much open to interpretation. That makes for bad law. I am happy to welcome the minister’s commitment to go away and look at the matter and try to provide some clarity, because section 48 of the bill really needs it. However, I hope that the Government will stick to its intention that the powers under proposed new part 3A of the 2003 act will be used only as a last resort. I will make a brief comment on Sarah Boyack’s amendment 54, on the QLTR. I listened carefully to what the minister said about that. I have a situation in my constituency at the moment, of which the minister will be well aware, and it seems to me that the fact that the land has now fallen into not the ownership but the caretakership—if there is such a word—of the QLTR is helping the process of community purchase of the asset. The process would have been much longer and more drawn out if that had not been the case. I know that Sarah Boyack said that she would go away and think about the issue, but that is just one example of where the situation helps rather than hinders the process of community empowerment. I will leave it at that.
In the same item of business
The Convener (Rob Gibson)
SNP
Good morning, everybody, and welcome to the 10th meeting of the Rural Affairs, Climate Change and Environment Committee in 2015. Before we move to the first...
The Convener
SNP
We come now to section 48 and the first grouping of amendments, on land which is eligible to be bought under part 3A of the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003. ...
The Minister for Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform (Aileen McLeod)
SNP
Amendment 58 is a technical amendment that seeks to clarify that the land that might be bought under proposed new part 3A of the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2...
Michael Russell (Argyll and Bute) (SNP)
SNP
Most people would agree that section 48 is at the heart of the part of the bill that we are considering. I will address my amendments and the minister’s comm...
Sarah Boyack (Lothian) (Lab)
Lab
I look forward to hearing the minister’s wind-up speech. I agree with Mike Russell that this debate is key to the whole bill. I will speak about amendment 89...
Alex Fergusson (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con)
Con
I will be brief. I absolutely agree with Mike Russell and Sarah Boyack that section 48 is the core of the bill. It is also important to put it on the record ...
Claudia Beamish (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
Good morning, minister. I seek clarification in relation to amendment 60. Will there be a definition, if not in the bill then in regulations, of the amount o...
Graeme Dey (Angus South) (SNP)
SNP
I support Sarah Boyack’s concluding comments, in which she sought an understanding from the minister as to how in practice the minister and the committee wil...
The Convener
SNP
I will make a couple of comments. First, on a point that was raised about making land available, this is a process and not an event, as we know. I understand...
Aileen McLeod
SNP
I will try to answer the points that committee members have raised and I will start with amendment 34. I recognise the case that the committee has put forwar...
The Convener
SNP
Amendment 34, in the name of Michael Russell, has already been debated with amendment 58.
Michael Russell
SNP
On the basis of the minister’s reassurances, I will not move amendment 34. Amendment 34 not moved. Amendment 59 moved—Aileen McLeod—and agreed to.
The Convener
SNP
Amendment 89, in the name of Sarah Boyack, has already been debated with amendment 58.
Sarah Boyack
Lab
I would like to move amendment 89, because it is not just about consultation with interested parties; for me, it is also a timescale issue. I would hope that...
The Convener
SNP
The question is, that amendment 89 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No.
The Convener
SNP
There will be a division. For Beamish, Claudia (South Scotland) (Lab) Boyack, Sarah (Lothian) (Lab) Fergusson, Alex (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) ...
The Convener
SNP
The result of the division is: For 4, Against 5, Abstentions 0. Amendment 89 disagreed to. 10:45 Amendment 60 moved—Aileen McLeod—and agreed to. Amend...
The Convener
SNP
We move to group 2, which is on ways in which proposed new part 3A community bodies may be constituted et cetera. Amendment 62, in the name of the minister, ...
Aileen McLeod
SNP
During consultation on the bill, respondents have been clear about the need for ministers to offer a wider range of entities that a community body could use....
Claudia Beamish
Lab
I support all the amendments in the group. It is welcome that SCIOs and bencoms are to be included in the bill, and it is right that the eligibility requirem...
Aileen McLeod
SNP
I thank Claudia Beamish for her support. The key purpose of this group of amendments is to ensure that we protect our smaller communities. We want to ensure ...
The Convener
SNP
The next group is on applications for consent to buy under proposed new part 3A of the 2003 act: information to be included in application and criteria for c...
Aileen McLeod
SNP
The mapping requirements that are proposed in part 3A are similar to the mapping requirements in part 3 of the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003 on the croftin...
Dave Thompson (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP)
SNP
I will not say very much because the minister has said that she is happy to support amendment 45. I am pleased to hear that. The test that will be put in pla...
Sarah Boyack
Lab
I welcome amendments 73, 74 and 75 because they will help to remove hurdles to community purchase. In some circumstances, it can be a huge challenge to ident...
Alex Fergusson
Con
I return to the issue of clarity that I highlighted earlier. What disturbs me about Dave Thompson’s amendment 45—and the reason why I am afraid I cannot supp...
Aileen McLeod
SNP
I tried to point out in my remarks that, if agreed to, amendment 90 would require title to land to be transferred when the land was purchased, even if the cu...
The Convener
SNP
The question is, that amendment 45 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No.
The Convener
SNP
There will be a division. For Beamish, Claudia (South Scotland) (Lab) Boyack, Sarah (Lothian) (Lab) Dey, Graeme (Angus South) (SNP) Gibson, Rob (Caithne...
The Convener
SNP
The result of the division is: For 7, Against 2, Abstentions 0. Amendment 45 agreed to.