Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 10 December 2013
10 Dec 2013 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Human Rights
First, I congratulate the Scottish Human Rights Commission on the publication of its national action plan. It is significant that it had Scottish Government support and active participation; that sends a clear signal. The plan represents four years of hard labour for the SHRC and it has been fruitful. The purpose of the plan is:
“To focus and coordinate action by public, private, voluntary bodies and individuals to achieve human dignity for all through the realisation of internationally recognised human rights.”
For me, it is important that people understand and can affirm human rights, and a requirement for that understanding is education. As I said in my intervention, I see no threat in people understanding their human rights fully. In the longer term, problems will arise if people do not know their rights. If the national action plan is properly implemented, people should be pushing at an open door with authority to ensure that their rights are being respected.
We cannot say often enough that those rights are dignity, equality, freedom, autonomy and respect. Indeed, the PANEL—participation, accountability, non-discrimination, empowerment and legality—acronym has participation as a key element and there are opportunities with things such as consultative budgets and, as members have alluded to, the opportunity to participate in the compilation of our constitution, which has adopted a rights-based approach.
Accountability is the next element, and the Parliament has been criticised for not having a human rights committee and not appearing to address human rights issues overtly when we know that they are being addressed. Perhaps we need to be a bit more explicit about that.
Non-discrimination is the third PANEL element. We all have interests in particular areas. Ms Marra is genuinely interested in and concerned about the issue of female genital mutilation, and who would not be? Others, like myself, are interested in Gypsy Travellers, Roma, and blacklisting, all of which are important aspects that we have to pick up on.
Empowerment is very important, and we need to be alert to the role that advocacy plays in that, and how often it is the first thing that local authorities cut in these pressing times.
The national action plan will be relevant regardless of the outcome of the referendum, although I note that the report says that progress has been made since devolution, and it identifies the next steps. The minister rightly points out that we have a strong legal framework.
Perhaps surprisingly, Alex Johnstone referred to the deserving and undeserving as viewed in rights. He referred to one poll and I will refer to another. A recent Trades Union Congress poll brought out the many misconceptions about welfare and benefits spending. It found that
“On average people think that 41 per cent of the entire welfare budget goes on benefits to unemployed people, while the true figure is 3 per cent.”
That clearly has some resonance in the debate that we are having today.
It is interesting that the UK Government’s position should be brought up in this debate. I would have thought that Mr Johnstone would keep quiet about that because, just as Mr Cameron talks about slaying the health and safety monster, he takes a very similar approach to human rights, and there is no place for that. We will have an opportunity to address that in the coming months.
Health and social care has been touched on, and I think that independent living is a clear issue, as is the fact that the ever-present dignity and acknowledgement of the individual should be key to any care package.
The minister is right to talk about the Government’s commitment to abolishing homelessness, and that is very positive, but it has to be delivered in practice. However, the challenges remain for people such as prisoners who are released without a home to go to and who have difficulty in accessing medical treatment because general practitioners will not treat certain individuals who have addiction issues.
The action plan has a vision of a Scotland in which everyone is able to live with human dignity, and I do not believe that anyone will dissent from that.
15:19
“To focus and coordinate action by public, private, voluntary bodies and individuals to achieve human dignity for all through the realisation of internationally recognised human rights.”
For me, it is important that people understand and can affirm human rights, and a requirement for that understanding is education. As I said in my intervention, I see no threat in people understanding their human rights fully. In the longer term, problems will arise if people do not know their rights. If the national action plan is properly implemented, people should be pushing at an open door with authority to ensure that their rights are being respected.
We cannot say often enough that those rights are dignity, equality, freedom, autonomy and respect. Indeed, the PANEL—participation, accountability, non-discrimination, empowerment and legality—acronym has participation as a key element and there are opportunities with things such as consultative budgets and, as members have alluded to, the opportunity to participate in the compilation of our constitution, which has adopted a rights-based approach.
Accountability is the next element, and the Parliament has been criticised for not having a human rights committee and not appearing to address human rights issues overtly when we know that they are being addressed. Perhaps we need to be a bit more explicit about that.
Non-discrimination is the third PANEL element. We all have interests in particular areas. Ms Marra is genuinely interested in and concerned about the issue of female genital mutilation, and who would not be? Others, like myself, are interested in Gypsy Travellers, Roma, and blacklisting, all of which are important aspects that we have to pick up on.
Empowerment is very important, and we need to be alert to the role that advocacy plays in that, and how often it is the first thing that local authorities cut in these pressing times.
The national action plan will be relevant regardless of the outcome of the referendum, although I note that the report says that progress has been made since devolution, and it identifies the next steps. The minister rightly points out that we have a strong legal framework.
Perhaps surprisingly, Alex Johnstone referred to the deserving and undeserving as viewed in rights. He referred to one poll and I will refer to another. A recent Trades Union Congress poll brought out the many misconceptions about welfare and benefits spending. It found that
“On average people think that 41 per cent of the entire welfare budget goes on benefits to unemployed people, while the true figure is 3 per cent.”
That clearly has some resonance in the debate that we are having today.
It is interesting that the UK Government’s position should be brought up in this debate. I would have thought that Mr Johnstone would keep quiet about that because, just as Mr Cameron talks about slaying the health and safety monster, he takes a very similar approach to human rights, and there is no place for that. We will have an opportunity to address that in the coming months.
Health and social care has been touched on, and I think that independent living is a clear issue, as is the fact that the ever-present dignity and acknowledgement of the individual should be key to any care package.
The minister is right to talk about the Government’s commitment to abolishing homelessness, and that is very positive, but it has to be delivered in practice. However, the challenges remain for people such as prisoners who are released without a home to go to and who have difficulty in accessing medical treatment because general practitioners will not treat certain individuals who have addiction issues.
The action plan has a vision of a Scotland in which everyone is able to live with human dignity, and I do not believe that anyone will dissent from that.
15:19
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick)
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-08544, in the name of Roseanna Cunningham, on human rights.14:38
The Minister for Community Safety and Legal Affairs (Roseanna Cunningham)
SNP
Today marks the launch of “Scotland’s National Action Plan for Human Rights: 2013-2017”—Scotland’s first national action plan for human rights—and I am delig...
Jenny Marra (North East Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I ask the minister for clarification on that point. Would an independent Scotland take the Human Rights Act 1998 and embed it in the Scottish constitution or...
Roseanna Cunningham
SNP
We would be looking at exactly the kinds of rights that most countries in Europe and the wider world regard as human rights. I do not want to disappoint Jenn...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)
SNP
Would the minister care to commend Mary Robinson—who is a former President of a small country: Ireland—for her significant contribution to human rights in re...
Roseanna Cunningham
SNP
I am sure that Stewart Stevenson would expect me to endorse that, as I have met Mary Robinson and know the huge impact that she had internationally—not just ...
Jenny Marra (North East Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
It is particularly appropriate that we gather in the chamber today on international human rights day, and on a day that is marked by such a momentous occasio...
Sandra White (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP)
SNP
I thank Jenny Marra for taking an intervention. I know of her interest in the subject. When I was a member of the Equal Opportunities Committee we inquired i...
Jenny Marra
Lab
I got the numbers from the Minister for Public Health, Michael Matheson, who said just a few weeks ago in the chamber that 3,000 women are at risk in Scotlan...
Jean Urquhart (Highlands and Islands) (Ind)
Ind
I think that everybody will agree with what Jenny Marra said about the crime that she has described. However, forced marriages are still happening in Scotlan...
Jenny Marra
Lab
Presiding Officer, can I have a little more time to address that?
The Presiding Officer
NPA
I will tell you when you should stop.
Jenny Marra
Lab
Thank you.We have lodged our amendment because I do not believe that FGM is specifically mentioned in the human rights strategy and, given recent press repor...
Alex Johnstone (North East Scotland) (Con)
Con
I welcome the publication of the national action plan for human rights. There is certainly a strong element of consensus on the topic across the chamber and—...
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Ind)
Ind
About 15 years ago, the Northern Constabulary issued a book to young people about knowing your rights when dealing with the police. Is it not a positive thin...
Alex Johnstone
Con
It is, of course, positive that that sort of thing happens, but we must remember that we have to take the public along with us. If we concentrate merely on t...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
Conclude, please, Mr Johnstone.
Alex Johnstone
Con
As we come to the end of the opening speeches, I look forward to an in-depth discussion about the action plan, and to summing up at the end of the debate.15:03
Jamie Hepburn (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP)
SNP
It is right to have the debate on this, the 65th anniversary of the signing of “The Universal Declaration of Human Rights”. As the minister said, it is appos...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (Lab)
Lab
It is particularly important that we are debating Scotland’s first human rights action plan on international human rights day and the day on which we remembe...
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD)
LD
I join colleagues in celebrating international human rights day and in welcoming the publication of Scotland’s national action plan on human rights. I pay tr...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
I remind members to use full names when they are referring to colleagues.15:15
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Ind)
Ind
First, I congratulate the Scottish Human Rights Commission on the publication of its national action plan. It is significant that it had Scottish Government ...
Alex Johnstone
Con
It should be made clear that in what has been an interesting if short debate we will not have time to raise a number of points. Nevertheless, as John Finnie ...
Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab)
Lab
I am pleased to close for Scottish Labour in this short but important debate on Scotland’s national action plan for human rights and concur with members’ com...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
Before I call Roseanna Cunningham to respond to the debate, I advise members that this afternoon’s debates are on a follow-on basis. I remind members who wis...
Roseanna Cunningham
SNP
It is amazing how wide a variety of views can be encompassed even in a short debate such as this. Practically all the speeches have been constructive in addr...
Jenny Marra
Lab
Will the minister commit to voting tonight for a strategy on female genital mutilation?
Roseanna Cunningham
SNP
I will come to the Labour amendment later in my speech.The Government has enjoyed a productive, constructive relationship with the commission on a wide range...
Malcolm Chisholm
Lab
I am very sorry to hear what the minister is saying. Does she understand that Jenny Marra’s addendum accepts all the wording of the minister’s motion, but th...