Committee
Justice Committee 29 January 2013
29 Jan 2013 · S4 · Justice Committee
Item of business
Prison Visits
I agree. We saw some impressive work activities, such as portable appliance testing and woodwork, but there are fundamental problems, particularly with the short-term prisoner population. Some prisoners do not have the inclination to do anything, so getting them involved can be difficult. Those are the real issues. There is a shortage of about 250 activities places, which creates some pressure, but the underlying issue, particularly for those on short-term sentences, is that they face a very mundane day.At the end of our visit, we had a discussion with two prisoners who were due for release later in the week. When we asked them about short-term sentences and the issues of deterrence, punishment and rehabilitation, their answer was that their term in prison was an “inconvenience”. Boredom is an issue. As a result of my visits, my view on short-term prison sentences is becoming harder: to be honest, I do not think that they are worth much.
In the same item of business
The Convener
SNP
Item 4 on the agenda is a report on our prison visits. Members have visited Barlinnie, Edinburgh, Inverness, Low Moss, Perth and Polmont over the past two we...
John Finnie
Ind
We were made welcome. A lot of positive work is going on in Inverness. The issues include the limitations caused by the building’s construction and the conse...
The Convener
SNP
Perhaps later we can ask why the women’s unit is so successful. That is interesting.Colin Keir and David McLetchie both went to Saughton. It is HMP Edinburgh...
David McLetchie (Lothian) (Con)
Con
The prisoners’ work programme has limitations, many of which are to do with the significant number of relatively short-stay prisoners, in that it is harder t...
Colin Keir (Edinburgh Western) (SNP)
SNP
I agree. We saw some impressive work activities, such as portable appliance testing and woodwork, but there are fundamental problems, particularly with the s...
The Convener
SNP
Your report mentions internet restrictions and states that internet access for educational purposes is provided successfully elsewhere in the United Kingdom....
Colin Keir
SNP
From what I remember of the conversation that we had on that, the issue is about where to draw the line. Allowing internet access for educational purposes is...
The Convener
SNP
Alison McInnes and I visited Polmont.
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD)
LD
The visit was interesting and we were made very welcome. We had a good time exploring a number of things. There are particular challenges for a young offende...
The Convener
SNP
I will add a couple of points to that. I accept the difficulties about internet-based learning and I agree with Alison McInnes about what I call education by...
Graeme Pearson
Lab
I attended Low Moss last week. It is a very modern prison; it will be a year old next month. It has 700 prisoners, which is just about full to capacity. Ther...
The Convener
SNP
Does “Education attendance” mean formally sitting down to learn to read, write and count, or does it include—as I think it should—applied education?
Graeme Pearson
Lab
I think that the education includes all sorts of things. There may be a softness to it, in that prisoners who merely attend and show an interest will be incl...
The Convener
SNP
Sandra, do you want to tell us about your visit to Barlinnie? You went to the Bar-L.
Sandra White (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP)
SNP
Yes—I think that is what they called it when we walked in. It was very interesting—
The Convener
SNP
You got a hat out of it.
Sandra White
SNP
I got a hat and a mug—the clerk got a mug as well—which you cannot buy. Perhaps in later years the mug might appear as an heirloom on the “Antiques Roadshow”...
The Convener
SNP
I am conscious, having done it myself, that we have been speaking about purposeful activity, which is a spectrum of activities including activities to addres...
Sandra White
SNP
We should raise that point as we proceed with our inquiry. In Barlinnie, a number of the prisoners who took part in courses were able to get Scottish vocatio...
The Convener
SNP
Do employers go into Barlinnie?
Sandra White
SNP
Martin Plant Hire employs a number of prisoners; they do not use an apprenticeship process, but the prisoners work there. Various other companies are involve...
The Convener
SNP
You, too, had experience of the Bike Station, Alison.
Alison McInnes
LD
Yes.
The Convener
SNP
Do we know whether the people got jobs at the end of it?
Alison McInnes
LD
I think that one person was employed at the Bike Station after they had left prison.
The Convener
SNP
Roddy—you were at Perth prison.
Roderick Campbell
SNP
Yes. I will try to be brief, as a lot of the points have already been covered. I was impressed by the governor and his staff, including the deputy governor, ...
The Convener
SNP
I thank members for that.I suspend the meeting briefly to allow Colin McConnell to take his place so that members can ask questions in our purposeful activit...