Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 14 March 2012
14 Mar 2012 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Land Registration etc (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
I always do that.
Why are reserves necessary? First, because the keeper cannot have access to consolidated funds; she must balance her budget. She does not have recourse to knock on Mr Swinney’s door and ask for a top-up because things are not going well. The reserves have been far in excess of £75 million in the past 10 or 15 years. In a sense, that is a good thing, because it has allowed the keeper to deal with the losses that have been incurred over the past few years.
I draw members’ attention to the fact that applications have reduced from 438,000 in 2007 to only 245,000 in 2010-11. They have nearly halved, so the income from them has nearly halved. The keeper must have reserves to deal with the loss-making potential because, sadly, such situations arise.
Secondly, the keeper needs to keep reserves because land registration provides a state-backed indemnity. If something goes wrong, we pay out. That is one benefit of land registration. In one case south of the border, in England, our colleagues had to pay out £8 million for one case, so members can see that the keeper needs to be prudent.
The keeper also needs a reserve for investment in, for example, ARTL. In that context, Stuart McMillan sensibly devoted his speech to a practical matter. I take seriously the evidence that we heard from various solicitors about the ARTL system’s efficiency, and we will ensure that we consult on all such matters.
How long do I have, Presiding Officer?
Why are reserves necessary? First, because the keeper cannot have access to consolidated funds; she must balance her budget. She does not have recourse to knock on Mr Swinney’s door and ask for a top-up because things are not going well. The reserves have been far in excess of £75 million in the past 10 or 15 years. In a sense, that is a good thing, because it has allowed the keeper to deal with the losses that have been incurred over the past few years.
I draw members’ attention to the fact that applications have reduced from 438,000 in 2007 to only 245,000 in 2010-11. They have nearly halved, so the income from them has nearly halved. The keeper must have reserves to deal with the loss-making potential because, sadly, such situations arise.
Secondly, the keeper needs to keep reserves because land registration provides a state-backed indemnity. If something goes wrong, we pay out. That is one benefit of land registration. In one case south of the border, in England, our colleagues had to pay out £8 million for one case, so members can see that the keeper needs to be prudent.
The keeper also needs a reserve for investment in, for example, ARTL. In that context, Stuart McMillan sensibly devoted his speech to a practical matter. I take seriously the evidence that we heard from various solicitors about the ARTL system’s efficiency, and we will ensure that we consult on all such matters.
How long do I have, Presiding Officer?
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick)
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-02304, in the name of Fergus Ewing, on the Land Registration etc (Scotland) Bill.13:34
The Minister for Energy, Enterprise and Tourism (Fergus Ewing)
SNP
I thank the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee for its thorough and collaborative scrutiny of the Land Registration etc (Scotland) Bill. I also thank the ...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
I declare my interest as a member of the Law Society of Scotland.As convener of the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee, I mention that the committee recom...
Fergus Ewing
SNP
I will consider further and respond in due course on reduced fees for voluntary registration. Does Mr Fraser agree that there is an incentive for voluntary r...
Murdo Fraser
Con
The minister has made a fair point. In his opening speech he mentioned the proposal to introduce time-and-line fees. Higher costs would potentially act as a ...
Fergus Ewing
SNP
I do not want to interrupt the flow of Mr Fraser’s speech too frequently, but I ask him—as one solicitor to another—whether it is fair to say that the high c...
Murdo Fraser
Con
That is a fair point, although I am sure that when Mr Ewing was in practice he was very reasonable in the fees that he charged—as, indeed, was I.The offence ...
Rhoda Grant (Highlands and Islands) (Lab)
Lab
I associate myself with the thanks that Murdo Fraser and the minister offered to those who provided evidence to and assisted the committee. The bill is large...
Mike MacKenzie (Highlands and Islands) (SNP)
SNP
Is it the Labour Party’s position that only companies or individuals who are resident and domiciled in Scotland should be able to buy land in Scotland?
Rhoda Grant
Lab
No. If Mr MacKenzie listens to the points that I will make, he might understand where I am coming from.The land reform legislation was based on the need to k...
Annabel Goldie (West Scotland) (Con)
Con
It is a challenge to bring some verve and spice to the issue of land registration. The subject does not brim with pulsating excitement. Things were a lot mor...
The Presiding Officer
NPA
We now move to the open debate. I remind all speakers that they have a fairly tight 10-minute time limit. Interruption. I am sorry: I meant to say four minut...
John Wilson (Central Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
I speak as a member of the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee, which held a number of evidence-gathering sessions as part of its detailed examination of t...
John Park (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)
Lab
I thank the clerks for the support that they gave me as a new member of the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee when I started in January, just after the C...
Mike MacKenzie (Highlands and Islands) (SNP)
SNP
I am pleased to have the opportunity to speak in the debate. Although I am what Murdo Fraser has described as “a non-lawyer”—I wonder whether that is a Latin...
Stuart McMillan (West Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
As one of the non-lawyers on the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee, it was with a sense of trepidation that I started out on my journey through scrutiny ...
Hanzala Malik (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
This is an interesting topic. I have witnessed huge amounts of difficulty overseas, in particular for farmers who have smallholdings. When an inheritance has...
Jean Urquhart (Highlands and Islands) (SNP)
SNP
When I offered to speak in today’s debate, I was aware that I would be doing so more from a sense of how important the bill is than from a position of taking...
James Kelly (Rutherglen) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to speak in this debate on the Land Registration etc (Scotland) Bill. As someone who is not a member of the Economy, Energy and Tou...
Paul Wheelhouse (South Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
I should declare an interest. I worked for BiGGAR Economics when it did the piece of work for Registers of Scotland on the economic impact of its proposals. ...
Rob Gibson (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP)
SNP
As the convener of the Rural Affairs, Climate Change and Environment Committee, I have an interest in the Land Registration etc (Scotland) Bill dovetailing w...
Patrick Harvie (Glasgow) (Green)
Green
I strongly commend Rob Gibson for much of what he said. In addition, I thank everyone who contributed to the committee’s work, in whatever capacity.My fellow...
Annabel Goldie
Con
It is difficult in an essentially technical debate to introduce ideas and concepts without risking repetition. I prefer to comment briefly on one or two poin...
Ken Macintosh (Eastwood) (Lab)
Lab
I acknowledge that, although the bill is largely technical, most of its proposals have been welcomed and are required if we are to improve land registration....
Fergus Ewing
SNP
I have thoroughly enjoyed the debate. There have been useful contributions from all sides. If I do not reply in my short speech to some of the suggestions an...
Fergus Ewing
SNP
I will carry on for a bit, if I may.Mr Harvie acknowledged that point, as did others. I can tell him that we have had some discussions on the matter and offi...
Patrick Harvie
Green
Will the minister allow his officials to have discussions with Opposition members prior to stage 2, so that we understand the limits of what the Government t...
Fergus Ewing
SNP
I always do that.Why are reserves necessary? First, because the keeper cannot have access to consolidated funds; she must balance her budget. She does not ha...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott)
Con
You have another four minutes.
Fergus Ewing
SNP
Oh good. I thought that I needed to finish.