Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 16 March 2011
16 Mar 2011 · S3 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Domestic Abuse (Scotland) Bill
I thank all members who took part in the debate for their kind words—in fact, their words were so kind that when Roseanna Cunningham came into the chamber she asked whether I was standing down at the election, because people were being so nice to me. I tell her that it is not my intention to stand down, but that is up to the voters.
Before I address the points that arose in the debate, I will take a couple of minutes to thank some people, without whose help the bill would not be in front of us today. First, I thank all those who responded to the consultation. Special mention must go to Scottish Women’s Aid, both nationally and the various local offices. There are far too many people to mention, but I appreciate all their help, especially that of Louise Johnson, who helped every step of the way.
I also need to thank my staff and researchers, who have come and gone over the piece. Special thanks go to Marian Grimes, who helped me focus, and Liza Gilhooly, who has accompanied me throughout the whole parliamentary process. I am sure that Liza will be delighted that Nigel Don has studied the financial memorandum, because she put a lot of blood, sweat and tears into it.
I thank Unison, which sponsored the bill. I thank Dave Watson, Fiona Montgomery, Norma Black and Unison’s women’s committee. I also thank Norman MacAskill for designing the consultation document and Catriona Burness for pulling together case studies.
A huge thank you goes to James Clark, because the bill would not have got to this stage without him. I also thank Clare Connelly, who came up with the solution for how the bill could be shaped to tackle the issues. Clare carried out the 2003 study on civil protection orders, “An Evaluation of the Protection from Abuse (Scotland) Act 2001”, which gave her a clear understanding of what needed to be done.
I also want to thank parliamentary staff—committee clerks and support staff. Mike Pringle said that they are sometimes the unsung heroes and I am very grateful for all their help and support.
I need to extend a special thanks to the Parliament’s legislation team, who were wonderful, particularly Frances Bell. Frances was in the chamber for the earlier stages of the debate, when I was on my toes. One instance of how hard she works is that she phoned me at midnight over the Easter weekend last year, when she was still in the office and I was at home with a glass of wine. I am extremely grateful for that level of dedication.
I thank the committees for their scrutiny of the bill, and Fergus Ewing and his staff and officials for their help in drafting the amendments and their work to solve some of the highly technical issues that we faced.
I say a big thank you to Carol—that is not her real name—who allowed her story to be told to illustrate how the bill would help victims of domestic abuse. Last but not least, I thank Maureen Macmillan, who suggested the bill in the first place. I am not sure whether I should be thanking her or just saying, “That’s another fine mess you got me into.”
I appreciate the really good comments that members made during the debate. I am grateful to the minister for undertaking to investigate the barriers that exist. The problem may not be with legal aid, but with solicitors who may not be using the available provisions. I would be grateful if that were looked at as part of the research that the minister is to have carried out. I am grateful to SLAB and the minister for agreeing to further publicise the protections that are available for people who suffer from domestic abuse.
Robert Brown talked about the police and how they are now dealing seriously with domestic abuse. The bill will give them the tools that they badly need to help them to tackle the issue. The domestic abuse figures have fallen as a result of the work that they have been doing, and I hope that that will continue. Indeed, I hope that no victim will need to use the bill and that the police will offer them the assistance that they need without their having to go to court.
Stewart Maxwell and Bill Butler reminded us of the need for legislation by giving us stark statistics that highlight why we need to protect people. James Kelly said that the bill will improve access to justice and protection, and I very much hope that it will. Bill Aitken said that he hoped that I did not think that I was getting half a loaf; I do not. I am very pleased with the support that I have had, for which I am extremely grateful, and I thank Bill for his help throughout the process.
As others said, non-harassment orders will be much easier to obtain. As Bill Butler said, it was wrong that a course of conduct had to be shown before someone could get a non-harassment order. The bill will stop that happening. It will also mean that the state will deal with breach of domestic abuse interdicts. Nigel Don suggested that perhaps we should go further and have the state deal with all breaches of interdicts, but I, for one, am pleased that the bill will mean that people who suffer from domestic abuse will get that specific protection. Victims will no longer be responsible for going back to court to get redress.
A number of members, including Richard Baker and Stewart Maxwell, talked about the increase in domestic abuse that takes place around Christmas, around football matches and around alcohol consumption, but let us be clear that there is no excuse for domestic abuse—none of those things is an excuse for it.
As I said, the bill is not the last word on domestic abuse. It is merely another step along the way. I hope that a day will come when, as a society, we will not tolerate such abuse and victims will no longer live in fear.
Before I address the points that arose in the debate, I will take a couple of minutes to thank some people, without whose help the bill would not be in front of us today. First, I thank all those who responded to the consultation. Special mention must go to Scottish Women’s Aid, both nationally and the various local offices. There are far too many people to mention, but I appreciate all their help, especially that of Louise Johnson, who helped every step of the way.
I also need to thank my staff and researchers, who have come and gone over the piece. Special thanks go to Marian Grimes, who helped me focus, and Liza Gilhooly, who has accompanied me throughout the whole parliamentary process. I am sure that Liza will be delighted that Nigel Don has studied the financial memorandum, because she put a lot of blood, sweat and tears into it.
I thank Unison, which sponsored the bill. I thank Dave Watson, Fiona Montgomery, Norma Black and Unison’s women’s committee. I also thank Norman MacAskill for designing the consultation document and Catriona Burness for pulling together case studies.
A huge thank you goes to James Clark, because the bill would not have got to this stage without him. I also thank Clare Connelly, who came up with the solution for how the bill could be shaped to tackle the issues. Clare carried out the 2003 study on civil protection orders, “An Evaluation of the Protection from Abuse (Scotland) Act 2001”, which gave her a clear understanding of what needed to be done.
I also want to thank parliamentary staff—committee clerks and support staff. Mike Pringle said that they are sometimes the unsung heroes and I am very grateful for all their help and support.
I need to extend a special thanks to the Parliament’s legislation team, who were wonderful, particularly Frances Bell. Frances was in the chamber for the earlier stages of the debate, when I was on my toes. One instance of how hard she works is that she phoned me at midnight over the Easter weekend last year, when she was still in the office and I was at home with a glass of wine. I am extremely grateful for that level of dedication.
I thank the committees for their scrutiny of the bill, and Fergus Ewing and his staff and officials for their help in drafting the amendments and their work to solve some of the highly technical issues that we faced.
I say a big thank you to Carol—that is not her real name—who allowed her story to be told to illustrate how the bill would help victims of domestic abuse. Last but not least, I thank Maureen Macmillan, who suggested the bill in the first place. I am not sure whether I should be thanking her or just saying, “That’s another fine mess you got me into.”
I appreciate the really good comments that members made during the debate. I am grateful to the minister for undertaking to investigate the barriers that exist. The problem may not be with legal aid, but with solicitors who may not be using the available provisions. I would be grateful if that were looked at as part of the research that the minister is to have carried out. I am grateful to SLAB and the minister for agreeing to further publicise the protections that are available for people who suffer from domestic abuse.
Robert Brown talked about the police and how they are now dealing seriously with domestic abuse. The bill will give them the tools that they badly need to help them to tackle the issue. The domestic abuse figures have fallen as a result of the work that they have been doing, and I hope that that will continue. Indeed, I hope that no victim will need to use the bill and that the police will offer them the assistance that they need without their having to go to court.
Stewart Maxwell and Bill Butler reminded us of the need for legislation by giving us stark statistics that highlight why we need to protect people. James Kelly said that the bill will improve access to justice and protection, and I very much hope that it will. Bill Aitken said that he hoped that I did not think that I was getting half a loaf; I do not. I am very pleased with the support that I have had, for which I am extremely grateful, and I thank Bill for his help throughout the process.
As others said, non-harassment orders will be much easier to obtain. As Bill Butler said, it was wrong that a course of conduct had to be shown before someone could get a non-harassment order. The bill will stop that happening. It will also mean that the state will deal with breach of domestic abuse interdicts. Nigel Don suggested that perhaps we should go further and have the state deal with all breaches of interdicts, but I, for one, am pleased that the bill will mean that people who suffer from domestic abuse will get that specific protection. Victims will no longer be responsible for going back to court to get redress.
A number of members, including Richard Baker and Stewart Maxwell, talked about the increase in domestic abuse that takes place around Christmas, around football matches and around alcohol consumption, but let us be clear that there is no excuse for domestic abuse—none of those things is an excuse for it.
As I said, the bill is not the last word on domestic abuse. It is merely another step along the way. I hope that a day will come when, as a society, we will not tolerate such abuse and victims will no longer live in fear.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson)
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S3M-8136, in the name of Rhoda Grant, on the Domestic Abuse (Scotland) Bill. I repeat that we are very tight ...
Rhoda Grant (Highlands and Islands) (Lab)
Lab
It gives me great pleasure to open the debate. The bill has taken a long time to bring forward, and there were times when I thought that we would never get h...
The Minister for Community Safety (Fergus Ewing)
SNP
I am grateful for the opportunity to outline the Government’s approach to the bill.In one unfortunate respect, the bill is timely, in that the incidence of d...
Richard Baker (North East Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I join all those who have commended Rhoda Grant for bringing before Parliament this important legislation to tackle domestic abuse. She can be proud of her w...
Bill Aitken (Glasgow) (Con)
Con
Instances of domestic abuse in Scotland remain stubbornly—indeed, disgracefully—high. There were 51,926 incidents of domestic abuse in the last recorded year...
Robert Brown (Glasgow) (LD)
LD
The bill addresses a serious matter to which the Parliament has devoted quite a bit of attention over the years since 1999 and which calls for serious politi...
Stewart Maxwell (West of Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
I begin where Robert Brown left off by saying how much I admire the work that Rhoda Grant has undertaken on the bill. It is not easy to take through any memb...
Bill Butler (Glasgow Anniesland) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to support the motion in the name of my Labour colleague Rhoda Grant. I offer her my unreserved congratulations on bringing to the ...
Nigel Don (North East Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
I congratulate Bill Butler on that exposition of what Parliament is about, with which of course I entirely concur. I also congratulate Rhoda Grant on introdu...
Mike Pringle (Edinburgh South) (LD)
LD
Like all other members who have spoken in the debate this afternoon, I congratulate Rhoda Grant on getting the Domestic Abuse (Scotland) Bill through to stag...
Bill Aitken
Con
I thank Mike Pringle for his kind remarks, which I appreciated.I hope that when the bill is passed, Rhoda Grant does not feel that because of what happened t...
James Kelly (Glasgow Rutherglen) (Lab)
Lab
I, too, congratulate Rhoda Grant on what I am sure will be the passing of the bill later this afternoon. As Mike Pringle said, navigating a member’s bill thr...
Fergus Ewing
SNP
Maureen Macmillan was referred to earlier in proceedings, and I am delighted to see that she is in the public gallery witnessing the debate. I recall from st...
Rhoda Grant
Lab
I thank all members who took part in the debate for their kind words—in fact, their words were so kind that when Roseanna Cunningham came into the chamber sh...