Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 27 October 2011
27 Oct 2011 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Scots Criminal Law (Integrity)
I preface my remarks by stating for the record that I am a member of the Law Society of Scotland and that I hold a current practising certificate. I remember well the case of Donoghue v Stevenson, which my colleague George Adam brought up. I did not expect to hear about that case today, but I guess that that is just one of those things.
As a lawyer, the starting point for me in the debate is the fact that the Scottish legal system is independent, even if other areas of life in Scotland are still to catch up—although I firmly believe that that will happen before long. As a Parliament, we have a duty to do what we can to preserve the integrity of our legal system and to ensure that it works in a coherent way.
I want to deal directly with the point that Johann Lamont—who is moving her chair—raised. The debate is not some exercise in constitutional navel gazing, nor is it a discussion of an issue that has no impact on the real lives of hard-working people, as my colleague mentioned. It is a debate that deals directly with the operation and the efficiency of our legal system, which is important to all of us.
I very much welcome the comprehensive report that the independent review group led by Lord McCluskey has provided. As the cabinet secretary said, the Scottish Government has accepted the report’s recommendations, and I understand that the Lord Advocate has written to the Scotland Bill Committee to set forth the kind of provisions that should be included in the Scotland Bill if the recommendations are to be implemented. Kenny MacAskill said that he is now progressing matters in his capacity as Cabinet Secretary for Justice.
As we have heard, one of the key recommendations concerns certification; specifically, it states that an appeal from the High Court of Justiciary to the UK Supreme Court should be competent only when the High Court has granted a certificate that the case raises a point of law of general public importance. That will deal with the anomalous situation in which certification is required as a matter of principle in the other UK jurisdictions, even if there are exceptions in certain cases. As a general rule, allegations of convention rights incompatibilities that occur elsewhere in the UK do not reach the Supreme Court unless there is certification.
That goes back, as Alison McInnes mentioned in a slightly different context, to the fact that the House of Lords was the final court of appeal for criminal matters for those other jurisdictions, which is not the case in Scotland as enshrined in the acts of union. When the Human Rights Act 1998 was passed, the certification rule was implicitly extended to cover compatibility cases in the other UK jurisdictions.
However, even if that was not the case, and there was suddenly no certification system in the other UK jurisdictions—as I understand it, there has been no significant attempt to abolish that requirement in the rest of the UK—it would still be necessary, in my view and the view of the McCluskey review group, to ensure that the High Court’s historical position as the final court of criminal appeal in Scotland was preserved given that we have an asymmetrical set-up in the UK.
Paragraph 41 on page 15 of the review group’s report states:
“In particular, we seek to ensure that the Scottish criminal justice system, unique amongst the constituent systems of the UK in its historical independence from the apex criminal appeal court for the rest of the UK, should not now, in the area of Convention rights, become more subject to interference from that apex court than the courts of these other systems.”
That states the review group’s position on certification very clearly. There has been interference from the UK Supreme Court, and we need to do something about it now that the opportunity has presented itself in the form of the Scotland Bill.
Concerns have been expressed about a possible diminution of the individual’s rights if such a certification system were to be introduced in Scotland, but I simply do not agree. Those concerns are based on a misunderstanding of the UK Supreme Court’s role. The High Court in Scotland has always been the final court of appeal in criminal matters. It is the competent court, and it is perfectly capable of continuing its centuries-old role. It was never intended that the UK Supreme Court should have jurisdiction over Scots criminal law decisions as if it were a new and final court of appeal in Scottish criminal cases, as the review group has pointed out.
As a lawyer, the starting point for me in the debate is the fact that the Scottish legal system is independent, even if other areas of life in Scotland are still to catch up—although I firmly believe that that will happen before long. As a Parliament, we have a duty to do what we can to preserve the integrity of our legal system and to ensure that it works in a coherent way.
I want to deal directly with the point that Johann Lamont—who is moving her chair—raised. The debate is not some exercise in constitutional navel gazing, nor is it a discussion of an issue that has no impact on the real lives of hard-working people, as my colleague mentioned. It is a debate that deals directly with the operation and the efficiency of our legal system, which is important to all of us.
I very much welcome the comprehensive report that the independent review group led by Lord McCluskey has provided. As the cabinet secretary said, the Scottish Government has accepted the report’s recommendations, and I understand that the Lord Advocate has written to the Scotland Bill Committee to set forth the kind of provisions that should be included in the Scotland Bill if the recommendations are to be implemented. Kenny MacAskill said that he is now progressing matters in his capacity as Cabinet Secretary for Justice.
As we have heard, one of the key recommendations concerns certification; specifically, it states that an appeal from the High Court of Justiciary to the UK Supreme Court should be competent only when the High Court has granted a certificate that the case raises a point of law of general public importance. That will deal with the anomalous situation in which certification is required as a matter of principle in the other UK jurisdictions, even if there are exceptions in certain cases. As a general rule, allegations of convention rights incompatibilities that occur elsewhere in the UK do not reach the Supreme Court unless there is certification.
That goes back, as Alison McInnes mentioned in a slightly different context, to the fact that the House of Lords was the final court of appeal for criminal matters for those other jurisdictions, which is not the case in Scotland as enshrined in the acts of union. When the Human Rights Act 1998 was passed, the certification rule was implicitly extended to cover compatibility cases in the other UK jurisdictions.
However, even if that was not the case, and there was suddenly no certification system in the other UK jurisdictions—as I understand it, there has been no significant attempt to abolish that requirement in the rest of the UK—it would still be necessary, in my view and the view of the McCluskey review group, to ensure that the High Court’s historical position as the final court of criminal appeal in Scotland was preserved given that we have an asymmetrical set-up in the UK.
Paragraph 41 on page 15 of the review group’s report states:
“In particular, we seek to ensure that the Scottish criminal justice system, unique amongst the constituent systems of the UK in its historical independence from the apex criminal appeal court for the rest of the UK, should not now, in the area of Convention rights, become more subject to interference from that apex court than the courts of these other systems.”
That states the review group’s position on certification very clearly. There has been interference from the UK Supreme Court, and we need to do something about it now that the opportunity has presented itself in the form of the Scotland Bill.
Concerns have been expressed about a possible diminution of the individual’s rights if such a certification system were to be introduced in Scotland, but I simply do not agree. Those concerns are based on a misunderstanding of the UK Supreme Court’s role. The High Court in Scotland has always been the final court of appeal in criminal matters. It is the competent court, and it is perfectly capable of continuing its centuries-old role. It was never intended that the UK Supreme Court should have jurisdiction over Scots criminal law decisions as if it were a new and final court of appeal in Scottish criminal cases, as the review group has pointed out.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott)
Con
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-01133, in the name of Kenny MacAskill, on ensuring the integrity of Scots criminal law.14:59
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill)
SNP
Scotland has a unique legal tradition that is many centuries old and proudly independent. The existence of distinctive Scots law predates the treaty of union...
Johann Lamont (Glasgow Pollok) (Lab)
Lab
Does the cabinet secretary think that the public might prefer him not to go on in great detail about the issue but instead address the key issue for the just...
Kenny MacAskill
SNP
I would have hoped that, on a matter of huge constitutional importance that is fundamental to the integrity of Scots criminal law, the member’s intervention ...
James Kelly (Rutherglen) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to take part in this afternoon’s debate. I thank Lord McCluskey and his colleagues for the work that they have done in producing no...
Kenny MacAskill
SNP
Does the member recognise that the Lord President’s letter says:“the High Court should be brought into line with the Court of Appeal (Criminal Division) and ...
James Kelly
Lab
If Mr MacAskill looks back at the submissions to the expert group that Lord Wallace established, he will see that only two submissions supported the route th...
John Lamont (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con)
Con
I, too, welcome the opportunity for members to look in detail at the final report by Lord McCluskey’s review group. We had an informative debate on the inter...
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD)
LD
I, too, welcome the opportunity to debate the review group’s report and set it in the context of the wider debate. I find it interesting that, after the Gove...
Kenny MacAskill
SNP
The member seems to be suggesting that, south of the border, the UK Supreme Court is the final court of appeal on criminal matters. Given that it is accepted...
Alison McInnes
LD
I do not agree. The reason for having certification south of the border is the vast number of cases that might appear in the Supreme Court. The number of suc...
Roderick Campbell (North East Fife) (SNP)
SNP
I declare an interest as a member of the Faculty of Advocates.I welcome the findings of Lord McCluskey’s further report as part of the on-going debate about ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
I have a wee bit of time in hand for interventions.15:40
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (SNP)
SNP
The debate is about Scots law, not about any other system. It is about respect for the unique features of Scots law.When the UK Supreme Court commenced opera...
Hugh Henry (Renfrewshire South) (Lab)
Lab
It is hard to conclude that the Scottish Government is, as John Finnie suggested, outward looking on the issue that we are discussing, because everything tha...
Annabelle Ewing (Mid Scotland and Fife) (SNP)
SNP
Will the member give way?
Hugh Henry
Lab
Certainly.
Annabelle Ewing
SNP
I thank the member for giving way. It is interesting to hear about his research into the definitions of various words but it would be quite helpful if he cou...
Hugh Henry
Lab
Other members in my group have outlined their specific points on that, but we must take notice of the general context. Earlier this year intemperate and disg...
George Adam (Paisley) (SNP)
SNP
Obviously, I did not think things out too well when I sat down for this debate next to an advocate. However, I hope that I can show some good old-fashioned c...
David McLetchie (Lothian) (Con)
Con
Will the member give way?
George Adam
SNP
Against my better judgment, I will.
David McLetchie
Con
Is the member aware that the High Court got the Donoghue v Stevenson decision wrong in a sense? It was actually the House of Lords that established the princ...
George Adam
SNP
As I said, the cases that I have been discussing are civil, not criminal.The public believes and the cabinet secretary is correct to say that the distinctive...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
I remind members that we have a wee bit of spare time. Members taking interventions would be preferable to any shouting out from the seats.15:57
Annabelle Ewing (Mid Scotland and Fife) (SNP)
SNP
I preface my remarks by stating for the record that I am a member of the Law Society of Scotland and that I hold a current practising certificate. I remember...
James Kelly
Lab
Annabelle Ewing’s premise seems to be that the Supreme Court’s ability to take cases from Scotland should be limited. It was not clear from the cabinet secre...
Annabelle Ewing
SNP
If I understand James Kelly correctly, he is addressing the issue of deleting the reference to the Lord Advocate and extending it to cover public bodies, whi...
Graeme Pearson (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I thank Lord McCluskey’s group for the effort that it has made and the quality of the report that it has produced in such quick time and in unfortunate circu...
Derek Mackay (Renfrewshire North and West) (SNP)
SNP
Does the member not think that he, like many Labour Party members, is becoming victim to thinking that the debate is about the rhetoric rather than the subst...